quote:Originally posted by Raiden:
Just curious about definitions of stock vs modified, especially for purposes of car show. If the car is visually stock - maybe the wheels are changes so that we can actually put rubber on them and the car has been repainted a different color and the interior trim has been replaced with carbon fiber, but still looks pretty stock, is it stock or modified? Go one step further and take the 351C and blow it by 30 thousanths, is it now modified? Or is it for purposes of a Concours D'Elagance still not too modified to be "modified"?
It depends on the class you are entering. If you are entering a judged contest specifically for Panteras (and I know of no one who judges them) the tough class is judged upon how the car came off of the assembly line. They actually look at the engineering numbers on the parts. You loose points for lack of authenticity, and loose points for less than new condition.
This would also include things like the original decals on the wheels (Campagnollo), Ansa decals on the mufflers, etc.
It would also include the proper date codes on those parts judged upon the build date attached to the car.
In the past there were two exceptions made that I know of. That was for tires and paint. Since the advent of reproduction tires from people like Coker tire, depending on which car it is, tires might or might not be judged.
The Pantera was built using acrylic enamel paint. Most organizations do not require that on a repaint. They would allow for instance a two stage paint with clear over color even though the original paint is a one stage paint.
The EASY Concourse class allows original service parts for the original "assembly line" parts. Again there are two parts to it. Authenticity of parts and condition of those parts. Workmanship in assembling the car is also considered but can be covered with the "authenticity" judging, i.e., you loose points if the workmanship is way too good to be originally assembly line workmanship.
Every organization has it's own rules.
I only know of the Shelbys and Mustangs as they are judged for Concourse in the two catagories. You also have trailered and non-trailered. You are looking at something like 3000 hours of labor to restore them x whatever the hourly rate is. Usually around $75 but there are shops that do Feraris and other exotics that get $300 and hour.
The best way to get an opinion on your car is to pay a certified Gold Concourse Judge to do yours privately. If he's in LA and you are in Miami, you fly him in, pick him up at the airport and pay for his expenses while he is there then pay his fee.
Still wanna' play? It gets very expensive, very fast and it's like owning a race horse, it's a loosing proposition and you just do it for the sport?
I've been doing this for 40 years. The term then of a 100 point car was commonplace. Most judge on 300 points (some more) and the highest score I have heard of was 286, in the trailered class. There is no such thing as a 100 point car (300 total) in reality. It only exists in the language that the selling broker uses. Many have been sued for misrepresentation. Some have been threatened with a gun. I haven't seen any of those make the national evening news...yet.