Skip to main content

Closed50 replies

Header Swap FAQ

khansmithkhansmithMember
Hello Gents:
I will be swapping out the stock headers to Hall headers here shortly. I don't have a specific question but I was wondering if there were some general words of wisdom that I should consider before conducting the swap? Anything you learned you would like to share? Pitfalls? Best body contorsion to get to the header bolts?

Anything would be appreciated.

Thank You,
Khan
Original Post

Replies sorted oldest to newest

marlinjackmarlinjackThe Machinist #5723 AMARGOSA MACHINE 'Running on Empty- Middle of Nowhere'
...Use Grade 8 Bolts! Get the Best Quality Gaskets! You will need to Keep tightening them as You Compress the gaskets with many Hours of running the Engine; In the End You will have them Very Tight! Anything lesser and Your sure to Snap One Off!! Believe Me!
NEVER let the Bolts Loosen up or You WILL blow the Gasket Out for a good Leaking Tick!!
Start with Two Bolts to Hang the Headers Over The Gasket, First! Most Gaskets Leave the Two Ends Holes Open so they can be slid down between the header and the Head AFTER the Header has been Mounted LOOSELY with Just the 2 End Bolts; Helps Alot!
Then install All the rest of the Bolts BEFORE You begin to Tighten everything Up. START with the Center Bolts and work outward to the Ends, Tightening Evenly.
I am 6'6", have Long Arms; and can lean way-in on the (protected) fender to reach all of the Bolts.
If You have the rear wheels Off, it is very Easy to reach the Bolts from inside the wheel well, once the WHEELWELL SPLASH Shield is removed, especially the Drivers side. The Most Useful Tools are: 9/16" Socket on a 'Universal Joint' at the end of 12 Inch Extension, Driven by a 'Ratchet Handle'; and a SHORTY 9/16" 'BoxEnd Wrench'.
The Right side is More difficult with the Coolant Pressure Tank in the way! Not any longer, for Me, as I have relocated it 3 more inches towards the 'Outside'. (Also Makes it Infinitely Easier to get to the #4 Spark Plug)
Good-Luck with it! Plan time, and Take Your Time! Make It Fun! And when You Hear the New 'Music', It will All have been Worth It!!
Last edited by marlinjack
khansmithkhansmithMember
quote:
Originally posted by Tom@Seal Beach:
Khan, are you redoing the tail pipe/muffler sections? I've also got the Hall headers and am redoing the exhaust system with a 3" diameter tube back to a Magnaflow 3" single inlet/dual 2.5" outlet muffler.

I am going to keep the stock exhaust but perform some motifications similar to Mike's on Panteraplace.com
markcharltonmarkcharltonOld enough to know better and still young enough not to care. My '71 Pantera
Khan,

Having just helped a friend with this, I can tell you that access from the bottom is pretty good.

The advice above is all good. The splash shields should come off and having the shocks and springs out (as a unit) makes life a bit easier too, although not essential. There were (on my friend's car) a couple bolts that were very tight access (at the front of the engine) and having run the new bolts in and out of the holes (in the heads) a few times makes it much easier to finger-tighten them, saving tight-access wrench time. Obviously, as Marlin says, get all the bolts in a few threads before tightening any of them.

Mark
khansmithkhansmithMember
So I just attempted to remove my first bolt. Key word there is attempted. I put a lot of force to move it but it wouldn't budge. I have been soaking these bolts for past two weeks with liquid wrench. The fear I have is breaking off a bolt in the block. I feel like the bolt should have cracked open with the force I was putting out. What are all of your guys thoughts? Should I just replace the headers down the road when i need an engine rebuild or go at it again?
lf-tp2511lf-tp2511Member
Did you stop at that bolt?

Perhaps luck had you go to the worst one first?

Try the others. If your luck changes, perhaps you will just have that first one still holding on. With the rest of the ones out, some header wiggle might encourage the SOB to break free.

Of course heat is your friend with sticky bolts, but I know room is at a premium around those bolts and getting a torch, O/A or propane, in there will be tough.

Good luck

Larry
57545754If you're not kickin' up dust, you're collectin' it!
Every few months I see a post about 50/50 Acetone/ATF being one of the best penetrating oils you can use ... here's a copy from one of the many bulletin boards that mention it (I think it showed up here recently too) -

..........

... from the April/May 2007 edition of Machinist's Workshop. They did a test of penetrating oils where they measured the force required to loosen rusty test devices. Buy the issue if you want to see how they did the test. The results reported were interesting. The lower the number of pounds the better.

Penetrating oil . Average load .. Price per fluid ounce
None ................. 516 pounds .
WD-40 .............. 238 pounds .. $0.25
PB Blaster ......... 214 pounds .. $0.35
Liquid Wrench ... 127 pounds .. $0.21
Kano Kroil ........ 106 pounds .. $0.75
ATF-Acetone mix.. 53 pounds .. $0.10

..........
Last edited by 5754
pantera1887pantera1887Member
I had a bolt on my compressor mounting bracket that some clown installed that was too long and was bottomed out in the block. It would not come out with reasonable wrench torque and there was no way I wanted it to snap off in the block. My solution was to set my air powered impact wrench on the very lowest setting, installed the correct socket on the wrench, and then let it bang away at the bolt. The idea is to let the shock of the impact wrench work it loose not torque. After a few minutes of shocking, I went back to the regular wrench and tested to see if it was coming lose. It took a few attempts but worked pretty cool.

Mike
khansmithkhansmithMember
So been using the 50/50 mix and I got one bolt out. Just one so far. I will add some more mixture on today and let sit for 2 days. I also tried the impact gun on low torque. Nothing yet but maybe with a couple more days seepage there will be progress. I think the impact gun will be difficult to get at the bolts closer to the bulk head.
liv1sliv1sMember
You are definitely have the right approach in trying to remove the header bolts since, without the benefit of having the motor out of the car, you will have a heck of a time if you do break a bolt.

When you finally get the old bolts out, consider using good quality bolts as suggested before. Also, use anti-seize compound the threads of the new bolts to make future removals easier.

As for locking methods, I've looked at the ones that you've mentioned as well as others discussed somewhere else on this forum in the past and I went with nord-lock washers on SS ARP bolts and have had very good luck with them. Check out their web site for more info - www.nord-lock.com.

Good luck and happy wrenching.
liv1sliv1sMember
quote:
Originally posted by Husker:
LIV1S - Interesting design. How difficult is it to loosen?


The beauty of the design is that there is the ease of use to bolt and unbolt them. The locks work when compressed by the bolt heads. I've heard that the Nord locks have also been used on ZF trans ring gear bolts instead of safety wiring but I'm not about to do that convesion on mine since I've already gone through the trouble of safety wiring them.
J jb1490Member
quote:
has anyone crawled inside the engine standing on the trans? Is that advisable?

I do that all the time. I put one of those foam type knee boards (or a thick blanket) on top of the ZF and/or the camber bar. Just be careful not to break the ZF vent tube. I also cover the vent (large opening) on the bellhousing so that I don't drop anything inside.

John
T tomsealbeachMember
I crawl on top of the ZF all the time...I can't see that my/your body weight would harm the transaxle. I've seen the ZF transaxle used as the actual load bearing member in a friends late 60's early 70's vintage Can Am car chassis. McLaren was the first to start doing it where they actually removed the chassis members that ran to the back of the transaxle to support the transaxle. They hung the suspension off the transaxle and eliminated all supports using the engine/transaxle combo to support the rear of the car. The ZF was not the box of choice for most McLarens...it was the Hewland LG 600 because it would handle 800 horsepower with no problems. But there were a few cars that swapped in a ZF because it was a fully sychro'd box and easier to drive. Your weight shouldn't hurt the box.
khansmithkhansmithMember
Oh that is great news. I think this might help me get at some of the bolts without causing "leverage dents" on the body Smiler Although my body has lots of dents anyway so who would know?

Anyway, I am being so super careful with these bolts that I am now on week 3 on trying to get the headers off. Slow and easy....if I get frustrated or can't get a good line on the bolt, I move on...
captaintobeyscaptaintobeysMember
I just used a set of 12 points on my Falcon headers from percy, I think. They have a set screw that pushes a plunger in the center of the bolt. The plunger works to spread the ends of the bolts that are sloted. They basically mushroom inside the head to hold the bolts in place. A friend recommened them. He has used them for years on a couple of drag cars and they have never loosened
khansmithkhansmithMember
I plan on using anti-seize for the new bolts. I have actually heard that Malox is the best antiseize for header bolts (was on Gearz TV w/ Stacey David). I'll stick to my normal anti-seize but thought that was interesting.

I got two more bolts out today and my rear exhaust removed (each bolt at the collector sheared off!). Only 11 more to go!
57545754If you're not kickin' up dust, you're collectin' it!
quote:
I have actually heard that Malox is the best antiseize for header bolts


That's assuming you have any Malox left after the stress of getting the bolts off in the first place!

Are you still working with the ATF/Acetone and Patience, or have you found something better at this point?

You're past the 1/2 way point, woo hoo! I think this might actually be more interesting than most of the shows on TV these days!
Next
Views: 1,280
Post

Membership Required

We're sorry. You must be signed in to continue. Sign In or Register
×
Are you sure you want to remove from your Block List?
×
Loading...
×
When you block a person, they can no longer invite you to a private message or post to your profile wall. Replies and comments they make will be collapsed/hidden by default. Finally, you'll never receive email notifications about content they create or likes they designate for your content.
Note: if you proceed, you will no longer be following .
×
Link copied to your clipboard.
×