I am all for radar and laser jammers. Ever since the Automobile was concieved avoiding a penalty for speeding has been a cat and mouse game. The current anti-ticket offerings are small and easy to conceal, as for the legality, it's only illegal if you get caught Wink
True jammers are indeed illegal. If you get caught transmitting signals you will need an expensive attorney. What I suspect you saw is a "passive jammer". Those are not usually illegal because they do not transmit signal but rather claim to scramble the existing inbound signals and jumble them to the point they can't be interpreted by the cop.

Car & Driver tests dectectors every year including the passive jammers. Every year they find they are not worth the material in the plastic case. You might try the Car & Driver web site to see if you can see the last article.

As I remember, don't ask, it seems most real jammers are on a single band, because of cost. You need antennas on each of the four corners. The units allow the jammer driver to adjust the speed you want to show on the gun. The units are big bucks, several thousand dollars. So I have heard.
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The units allow the jammer driver to adjust the speed you want to show on the gun.

An thus the story of the 18 wheeler who was off the Interstate and cruising the city streets.

Seems he came across a local radar unit that found him doing 55mph, while he was obviously doing 30 or so.

Busted. Eeker
While not exactly a radar jammer, I saw this Laser jammer at SEMA and was impressed. As I understand it, Radar is being phased out by Laser due to it's accuracy and ability to correctly target the desired vehichle in heavy traffic. As for legality, the above website has a page that states "There are no federal laws in the U.S.A. that prohibit the ownership and/or operation of laser jammers. However, some states have enacted their own laws that do prohibit the use of these devices. These states include: Nebraska, Minnesota, Utah, California, Oklahoma, Virginia, Colorado, Illinois and Washington DC."
The last time I used one I turned it on for a second in a blind spot, got a signal, lifted quickly and turned it off immediately. A few minutes later I was stopped. The officer said... "We have detectors that pick up any transmitted signal - from jammers, and radar detectors. So either you give us your device now or we will tow your car in and tear it apart until we find it."
Deeb:

When you are pulled over, put the detector in your pocket or your wife's purse. They can't search your person unless they have reasonable cause to believe you are carrying a wepon or drugs. Then let them have the car - although I doubt the law would allow them to impound it just to search for a radar detector. I expect the cop was bluffing. I drove with a radar detector in Ontario, where they are also illegal, for years and never had any trouble. On the contrary, it saved my bacon many times.

Now that I live in the west, where radar detectors are legal, I have invested in a Valentine One. I agree with Shotgunrooms that they work well, although they do not help with instant on radar.
If Canadian search and seizure laws are similar to those of the U.S. your person could be searched. By intercepting a signal, they have developed probable cause to believe that you have a detector within the vehicle. If the units are known to be portable or easily removable from the vehicle, they could search your person for "fruits of the crime".
I could have used one on Friday. Coming home from Albany on 87 I got stopped for speeding. Freakin' radar.

Anyhow, 40 mins later I got stopped again. Different town, different officer, same deal, same exact speed - 85 in a 65. So its like $1,000 and 8 points!

It's crazy that we have no way to protect ourselves.
I think this might be license #4. I have managed to go almost three years without a ticket - then its one after the other.

I'll tell ya' after getting stopped and driving at the speed limit for a few minutes I just want to get out and run alongside the car.
Deeb,

Radar detectors are legal in B.C. and Alberta (hint, hint) and from personal experience with our donut-eating friends I'd say they outnumber Ontario speed traps about 5-to-1. Tickets are a huge source of income out west, and some roads are reduced speed (Banff-Canmore for example) which makes for an easy speed trap.

Side story - I met Mike Valentine at a conference once, I was talking to him thinking "I met this guy somewhere before" and realized it was seeing his picture in Road & Track for 20 years..! It turns out he is exactly the passionate mad-scientist guy he portrays in the magazine ads. Very clever fellow.
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So either you give us your device now or we will tow your car in and tear it apart until we find it.

For that situation, I suggest you visit Pep Boys and buy one of their $29 radar detectors. Keep it handy in your car, and surrender THAT one.

The $400 Valentine stays safely under the seat. Big Grin

Larry
WOW, Big fine and the points, here in Michigan thanks to our Canadian Governor we now have a penalty fee for points on our driving records. It's $100 per point per year for three years or longer, depends on how long the ticket stays on your record. If I remember right Granholm brought this "fee" from Canada.
Jeff
Why do you feel so mad that you are getting a speeding ticket. There is no need to protect yourselves. You ARE breaking the law!!! It is no different than someone who robs a bank complaining that there must be some way to protect them from getting monitored or caught. Drive the speed limit and there is no problem. I have never received a speeding ticket.

Now seat belt laws. That one makes me mad!!!
Dave:

Although I can only really speak for myself here, I suspect the reason most people get angry with speeding tickets is that we disagree with the law. We disagree with the law because it is more about making money for government than about safety, which is the basis on which it is sold to the voters.

Also, some of us just hate being told what to do by self-righteous safety Nazis who want to save us from ourselves whether we like it or not. I suspect you share that sentiment, based on your stated aversion to seat belt laws.

Don't get me wrong; I'm a law and order kind of guy. I do understand that the rule of law is a precondition of civil society. But when governments are writing over 100 pages of new laws every 24 hours, which I believe is the statistic in your country, then breaking some of the more irksome, useless and vexatious laws starts becoming a necessity. I doubt there is a single person alive and over the age of five in North America who has not broken one law or another in their life.

- Peter
Speaking just for me, I get angry about speeding tickets because they are usually a set up. I got pulled over on a side highway for doing 40 in a 30 (yes basically highway with a 30mph speed limit). He told me it's an easy place to catch people and to pull them over. They also like like to stop people on side streets in 20-30mph zones for seatbelts.

All of this by staying as far away as possible from the truly problematic aggressive drivers on the freeway. They make easy ticket stops at easy locations and totally avoid doing anything to catch the problem drivers.

Rant off.
We break laws everyday that we don't even know exist! I think it's in Virginia where it's illegal to kiss your wife on a Sunday. Let's not even talk about jaywalking, or sitting at a traffic light with the car in neutral (for you stick drivers). At anytime, a cop can stop you for breaking some kind of law and make it stick!(Even if they just want to say you did it.) They do it all the time.

Michael
I have no problems with laws. Only with logic.

It is not unsafe to drive faster than the posted limit. Especially since the highway speed when I was a kid was 80 mph and there were a lot less accidents.

Poor drivers, bad training and worse education has resulted in all laws being created by and for the lowest common denominator. Dumbed down for the masses.

There's no mystery. We're lowering the standards in our schools because we don't pay our teachers enough. Students don't get involved, they don't want to study and so they get the resulting bad marks. So we lower the standards. Axe anyone who knows.

Same with our stupid television shows and other mindless media forced on us. Dumb and dumber we get.

I suppose in the confines of my car, without network TV or sound bite politics I get lost in reality and drive within my limits. Without thinking, I automatically defend myself and my passengers by carefully avoiding the drones who have no idea what they're doing on the road - driving in the left lane, beside those in the right lane who are also barely hitting the minimum speed creating a virtual moving roadblock, never looking in their mirrors, totally unaware of what's around them, waiting to the last minute before making a decision that never comes, following eachother like sheep to slaughter.

No wonder I get the speeding tickets.

The female officer on ticket #2 was like 4'-5" with a big brown hat. She said, "Hello, my name is Officer Smith." Sheesh, I though she was going to follow that up with... "and I'll be your officer for the next few minutes. Would you like fries with your ticket? Have a great highway day."

Okay, I am getting a little crazy as I vent. But I feel better now. Just don't get me started on traffic regulations, customer service, public companies or politics.
Deeb,

I thoroughly enjoy reading your prose.

I don't have a problem with the speed limit. I just more often ignore it.

I drive within my capabilities, respecting the road conditions, respecting the weather conditions and within the capabilities of my vehicle.

On a day like today (here in Ottawa after a significant snowfall with the roads snowcovered) you would not see me drive anywhere near the 80 km/hr limit - more like 50-60 km/hr tops - even though I am driving a 4x4 Jeep Cherokee.

I recall driving back from Montreal on a freezing rain day (speed limit 100 km/hr and 80 km/hr minimum limit) never going over 40 km/hr. I wonder why the police didn't enforce the 80 km/hr minimum limit?

Like Deeb says - its for the lowest common denominator.

On the other hand: Given a nice sunny day, dry roads, no traffic, driving my DeTomaso on the highway ...

B.G.
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Why do you feel so mad that you are getting a speeding ticket. There is no need to protect yourselves. You ARE breaking the law!!! It is no different than someone who robs a bank complaining that there must be some way to protect them from getting monitored or caught. Drive the speed limit and there is no problem. I have never received a speeding ticket.

Now seat belt laws. That one makes me mad!!!


Confused Where your belt and there is no problem! I admit I drive beyond the speed limit, but never would I get in a car and travel without a seat belt on. Just look at the statistics, too many teens killed here and most of them could have walked away had they been wearing a belt.

UK Motorway speed limit is posted 70 mph, most traffic travels at 85-90 mph. Personally I feel much more 'alive' and in cotrol at 90+ mph (providing conditions are right) than drowsing along at 70mph.

An interesting study in Australia showed that fixed speed cameras do nothing to reduce accident rates and if anything they increase them as people try to brake at the last minute when they see the camera. It is nothing more than a money generating scheme.

Same here in Reno with Cops, the city keeps employing more and more traffic cops, never mind the increasing crime rate, homicides and gang violence due to the illegals. Why...becuase a traffic cop can generate their salary, plus more for the city.
Gentlemen, the most effective form of anti-radar is called a HARM missle. If a few of us so armed our cars with these speed traps would quickly dissapear from use. The tree of liberty must be refreshed with the blood of patriots and tyrants.
I never said I dont wear my seat belt. I always have, at least in the pantera. What I dont like is them telling me I have to or I get a ticket. Speeding, running red lights, turning without signaling, those all can cause accidents and hurt other people. Not wearing my seatbelt cannot cause harm to other people. Same way with wearing a motorcycle helmemt. We have seat belt laws to make revenue, but we let any fool talk on a cell phone all they want while driving and that is dangerous.
Dave:

I have to disagree with you. Speeding does not endanger anybody necessarily; EXCESSIVE speed given the road conditions, driver ability, mechanical worthiness of the car, etc does. I don't think anyone here is advocating going 150 mph in a school zone. We just want to be left alone when we are driving at a perfectly safe speed given the road conditions, our ability, the mechanical worthiness of our car, etc.

In fact, I get pretty tense whenever somebody starts going on about how "Speed Kills". That is pure sophistry. As if the minute your vehicle exceeds some arbitrarily determined limit it will somehow automatically veer into the path of an oncoming school bus. Yeesh. These tend to be the same people that I am regularly pulling out of the ditch in winter because they thought that driving the speed limit on ice means they were driving safely.

- Peter
quote:
Originally posted by CrazyDave:
I never said I dont wear my seat belt. I always have, at least in the pantera. What I dont like is them telling me I have to or I get a ticket. Speeding, running red lights, turning without signaling, those all can cause accidents and hurt other people. Not wearing my seatbelt cannot cause harm to other people. Same way with wearing a motorcycle helmemt. We have seat belt laws to make revenue, but we let any fool talk on a cell phone all they want while driving and that is dangerous.


CrazyDave...
I have to agree with you to a point, about the seat belts! That is, what about the guy that doesn't have Car Ins.! In Mexafornia it's a law but you have NO recourse against the state, they make the law but don't inforce it. Sorry...back to seat belts!
What about the guy with no Ins., wrecks his car and is badly hurt (not wearing a seat belt) we the people pay! If the guy was wearing a seat belts chances are he may not be as hurt? thus costing we the people less money to fix his sorry ass!
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Originally posted by Cuvee:
What about the guy with no Ins., wrecks his car and is badly hurt (not wearing a seat belt) we the people pay! If the guy was wearing a seat belts chances are he may not be as hurt? thus costing we the people less money to fix his sorry ass!


That sounds good in theory but I think there is so much more to the fight of seatbelt laws.

One is the law was pressed and flatly voted down. Latter the law was snuck in and pushed through.

When it did pass they said "It's ok, we are just going to write warnings no tickets"

Then they said, "well no big deal we are just going to ticket if your stopped for another reason".

Then one day with no announcement they changed it so they can pull you over just for a seatbelt violation and by then people had given up fighting it.

It left a very sore taste in people mouth. It doesn't feel like laws of a free society. Laws are a balance of what is agreed upon by those in society as neccesary or needed. This was pushed through in a more "communist method". People feel a severe loss of freedom.

Freedom isn't free. The ability to make choices for one self, the ability to make the decision to drive from burger king across the street to the movie theater without being pulled over because the cops would like to score an easy ticket or because they don't like the way you look.

It was politically motivated to the brainless PC feel good movement which gives the cops another way of pulling people over because they want to. I was once pulled over for doing 10 over on a dark night in an area where the speed limit is way under marked. I took my belt off to get my wallet out to get my drivers license. The cop was going to write me a seat belt violation.

It truly pisses me off because NOTHING is done to help stop the poor and dangerous driving. You always see battles on the expressway and continuous dissreguard for every law, rule and piece of common sense in driving yet they enact this law to make people "Feel good" about what they do.

Freedom isn't free and the risk is worth the freedom and the ability for people to be allowed to make their own decisions about what they do some times.
When they were pushing the seatbelt laws many voiced that if you wanted to make it fair, let the insurance companies handle it. You pay for coverage. If you don't wear seatbelts then compensation is different and possible loss of coverage. Even coverage by some one at fault would be based on the assumption the other person is wearing seatbelts. If not, his coverage is limited even if not at fault.
My take on speeding is general respect for the laws everyone has to follow. If I follow in traffic and some one flies by I think "Why can't I do that?" And so many start doing so. When you get one driving fast and aggressively suddenly you have several. This begets the tailgater's, the people cutting everyone off, cutting in. It seems innocent enough but it is never as simple as it seems.

BUT>>>>>>>>>>>

If a tree falls in the woods and NO ONE IS AROUND TO HEAR IT, did it make a noise?
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Originally posted by PanteraDoug:
I suppose that the ORIGINAL question I asked has been answered hasn't it? DT take off the blackface and get out of the bushes. Now is not the time.

I can't hep it Doug. I get carried away sometimes. Smiler
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My take on speeding is general respect for the laws everyone has to follow. If I follow in traffic and some one flies by I think "Why can't I do that?" And so many start doing so. When you get one driving fast and aggressively suddenly you have several. This begets the tailgater's, the people cutting everyone off, cutting in. It seems innocent enough but it is never as simple as it seems.


Huh? If I'm on a hill and see a guy ski off a ramp 1,000 ft in the air do I run up there and give it a go? When I watch a scientist mixing explosive chemicals do I reach over and start pouring?

I think that generally we all know and abide by our own limitations. And needs. If you don't want or need to go fast (even I feel that way sometimes when embroiled in an important phone call) just stay in the right lane, watch your mirrors and don't slow anyone else down.
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Originally posted by comp2:
My take on speeding is general respect for the laws everyone has to follow. If I follow in traffic and some one flies by I think "Why can't I do that?" And so many start doing so. When you get one driving fast and aggressively suddenly you have several. This begets the tailgater's, the people cutting everyone off, cutting in. It seems innocent enough but it is never as simple as it seems.
It does not happen on the Autobahn, and it did not happen in Montana when they eliminated speed limits for a period of time (traffic fatalities actually dropped). The facts show that it is, indeed, as simple as it seems...
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Why do you feel so mad that you are getting a speeding ticket. There is no need to protect yourselves. You ARE breaking the law!!! It is no different than someone who robs a bank complaining that there must be some way to protect them from getting monitored or caught. Drive the speed limit and there is no problem. I have never received a speeding ticket.

Never a speeding ticket? You have never exceeded the speed limit?
The speed limit on our highways is usually 100kph. This is a joke. The average speed that cars are travelling on any major hiway is 120kph in the middle lane. 130 in the left.
The speed limits are a joke. It's the donkeys driving 100kph in the left lane(passing lane) and those who don't know how to merge onto a hiway (at hiway speeds) that cause major traffic problems.
I don't mind paying for a speeding ticket. It's the law and if I get caught, I should pay. What pisses me off is the speed traps on the downhill portion of a road. Or when they post a reduction with a tiny sign that you miss. You get a ticket for driving with the flow of traffic.
I got a "no right on red ticket" last month at a corner that I made rights at for 20 yrs. They posted a tiny new sign there and got the guys that had been turning there for years. They can't go after the wreckless clowns weaving in and out, they have to nail the everyday people, who in most part are decent drivers.
What really gets me is after paying the ticket, you get to pay for a huge increase in insurance premiums for years to come.
Why do my police friends never get speeding tickets?
Try cruising in the left lane at ANY speed in Europe and see what the other drivers do to you.
Speed doesn't kill. People who drive beyond their limit or their cars limit kill.
Will


Now seat belt laws. That one makes me mad!!!
quote:
Originally posted by deeb:
quote:
My take on speeding is general respect for the laws everyone has to follow. If I follow in traffic and some one flies by I think "Why can't I do that?" And so many start doing so. When you get one driving fast and aggressively suddenly you have several. This begets the tailgater's, the people cutting everyone off, cutting in. It seems innocent enough but it is never as simple as it seems.


Huh? If I'm on a hill and see a guy ski off a ramp 1,000 ft in the air do I run up there and give it a go? When I watch a scientist mixing explosive chemicals do I reach over and start pouring?

I think that generally we all know and abide by our own limitations. And needs. If you don't want or need to go fast (even I feel that way sometimes when embroiled in an important phone call) just stay in the right lane, watch your mirrors and don't slow anyone else down.


I don't think that even remotely applies to the point I was making.
Maybe I am mistaken, in which case I apologise, but I think your point was that seeing someone fly by and not get caught makes you want to do the same.

I don't see how that's a bad thng, unless some folks do it, even though they are way over their heads and really should stay where they are.

If we all decide to speed along carefully and safely then fine. Because that's what's happening anyhow. Driving on our highways you see everyone is way over the legal limit on any given day, until they come up to smokey on the side of the road.

Fast is not aggressive. And bad drivers are bad drivers. Period. I don't think they are enticed to become bad driver by those who are passing them in the passing lane.
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