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Pirelli P7 Tire Re-Issues (15 inch OEM wheels)

George PGeorge PAdmin.
Pirelli is currently celebrating its heritage, what this means for us is that they are more willing to re-issue P7 tires.

Re-issues of classic tires are "reproductions" in appearance and size, but they are constructed using modern rubber compounds and modern construction techniques. They "look" like the classic tire they are emulating in sidewall design and tread pattern, but they are thoroughly modern in terms of performance. A specific size of tire can only be re-issued if the tire model had been previously manufactured in that size.


Wide Body Pantera Owners:

Dougal Cawley of Longstone Classic Tyres says the 345/35ZR15 P7 shall be available any day now and the 285/40ZR15 P7 shall be available soon.

MONEY TALKS, to keep these classic tires available PLEASE support the efforts of Longstone Classic Tyres by giving them your business.


Narrow Body Pantera Owners can be divided into two groups ...

Group 1, those with an interest in 50 series Pirelli P7s:

Pirelli already makes a P7 re-issue of the 225/50VR15. But the 285/50VR15 hasn’t been “stocked” for a long time. Interpreting comments made by Dougal, it seems the 285mm tires, both 285/50 and 285/40, are considered odd-ball sizes. Dougal says he will “consider” asking Pirelli to re-issue the 285/50VR15 P7, especially if the 285/40ZR15 P7 sells well (the front tire for the wide body Panteras).

If you would like to see the 285/50VR15 re-issued please email Dougal and express your interest, give him an idea of the demand for tires in this size. His email address is: dougal@longstonetyres.co.uk

Group 2, those who prefer a larger diameter tire set, more akin to the Goodyear Arrivas:

All "Pre-1979" Panteras were equipped with either 70 series radials, or 60 series Arriva bias ply tires, about 6,600 Panteras. The Pirelli P7 tires were not OEM tires for the majority of Panteras, and they were never available in 60 or 70 series sizes; but that doesn't mean there isn't a worthy set of tires amongst the range of P7 tires that were manufactured. It has been my observation that most owners prefer a wider/lower profile tire than what their car was originally equipped with. So I have a "third set of tires" to suggest, available as Pirelli P7s, to meet the needs of the owners of Pre-1979 Panteras.

I have suggested to Dougal that Pirelli P7s re-issued in the sizes of 225/55VR15 and 275/55VR15 would be the ideal tire set for the majority of the 6,600 Pre-1979 Panteras (excepting for those Panteras whose owners prefer the smaller diameter 50 series P7s). I can't think of a more ideal set of tires for the narrow body Panteras, they have the "square shoulder", wide tread, low profile looks everyone prefers, they are 20mm wider than the Arrivas but not too wide. They are the proper width for the OEM wheels; the 275mm rear tire will fit either the 15x8 OR 15x10 rear wheels. They are the same diameters as the Arrivas, they are speed rated, they have the “period correct” look of the P7 sidewall and tread pattern, and they are thoroughly modern in terms of handling and performance.

If you would be interested in Pirelli P7s re-issued in these sizes for your Pantera please email Dougal and express your interest in this tire set.

-G
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larrywlarrywMember
I did email Dougal registering interest in Georges 'Group 2' 225/55/15-275/55/15 selection.
He replied:
"Hi, Sorry they are not making that combination. Have you read this thread on the De Thomaso (sic) forum (link to the recent thread)
I sort of guess this is where you're coming from.
Currently we can't get that set up perfectly."
Goes on to say he is going to study the thread more thoroughly, he's been at Goodwood last five days (lucky) and will give a better answer tomorrow. Regards, etc...

I'll let you all know what he says.
davidnunndavidnunnMember
All of the sizes Pirelli has reproduced are ex-OEM. As examples, the 225/50-15 and 345/35-15 are Lamborghini Countach sizes. Even the "oddball" 285/40-15 (w/ 225/50-15 front) is an OEM Porsche 911 size (RS, RSR, GP2, etc). Wide body Pantera owners just got lucky. I'm sure the push to produce these sizes came from Lamborghini and Porsche, who Pirelli has an ongoing relationship with. These applications also fit well with the marketing of Pirelli's vintage offerings. Don't underestimate how important that is. Longstone Tyre will be lucky to get a single P7 size reproduced for us and it will make their job much easier if it's an OEM size. We had all better get on the same page if we want this to get done. I'm not disputing the 275/55-15 is a better size for the rear of most regular body Panteras but I don't believe Pirelli will make the financial commitment to produce a non-OEM size and they certainly won't make two! I believe the only size we stand a chance of getting is the size of P7 that DeTomaso fitted to 10" rear wheels; the 285/50-15.
davidnunndavidnunnMember
George,

What I meant by OEM was DeTomaso OEM. Pirelli isn't re-making these P7 sizes for profit. It isn't necessarily about selling tires or determining the best fitment. It appears to be a marketing/advertising exercise more than anything. It's all about Pirelli's history and nostalgia. I'd even speculate that Pirelli already has a regular body Pantera sized tire (or tires) in the works. This paragraph is taken directly from Pirelli's European web site:

"Although it was officially launched onto the market in January 1976 in the road version, the Pirelli P7 had been experimented in the World Rally Championship races since 1974 with the Lancia Stratos. Named Supersport, the new radial brought important innovations into the world of racing tyres, such as the nylon zero degree belt and in particular an ultra- low profile geometry Serie 50. Thus, the development process of the low profile tyres that Pirelli had started with the Cinturati CN73, CN54 and CN36 (Serie 70) and with the Cinturato CN12 (Serie 60) between late ‘60s and early ‘70s, kept going on with the P7. In the same way that the road version led to making the Serie 50 available to standard- model cars, the P7 used in racing quickly introduced ultra-low profile sizes, all the way to the Serie 30. The road P7 was adopted for the first time on the Porsche 911 Carrera Turbo, followed by the Lamborghini Urraco and Countach in 1976, as well as by the De Tomaso Pantera. In the size 195/50 VR 15, the Pirelli P7 was also homologated for the road version of the Fiat 131 Rally.".

Perhaps we're more important to Pirelli than we think we are!
Last edited by davidnunn
George PGeorge PAdmin.
quote:

Originally posted by David_Nunn:

... I'd even speculate that Pirelli already has a regular body Pantera sized tire (or tires) in the works ...



Speculation gets us nowhere. I speculate they haven't. One mention in a history blurb means nothing, and promises less. I don't think Pirelli gives a damn about De Tomaso owners. Hasn't Dougal mentioned several times it would help get the 285/50VR15 reissued IF it had a fitment other than just the Pantera? It doesn't seem Pantera fitment has much weight in Dougal's mind.

Reissues of the 285/40VR15 and 345/35VR15 tire set, and reissues of the 225/50VR15 and 285/50VR15 tire set, are cool, I'd seriously like to see them in stock again. BUT those reissues only help (at most) 20% of the Pantera owners. What about everyone else? Do they keep using BF Goodrich?

If they were planning to issue a tire set for everyone else, then of course Pirelli shall issue it in an OEM sized set. Pirelli will not reissue tires in the size of the Goodyear Arrivas! That leaves the 185/70VR15 and 215/70VR15 tire set for the Pantera. Wouldn't a reissue in those sizes be a let down? I haven't seen or heard of anyone from Pirelli asking for our input. Do you want people to sit back and do nothing, just take whatever bones Pirelli throws us?

I've given Dougal his ammunition, the 225/55VR15 and 275/55VR15 tire sets were OEM on Bimmers and Bentleys. If Longstone Classic Tyres were to have P7s re-issued for the Bimmer and Bentley in the name of nostalgia who cares? Aren't the wide body tires actually reissued for Porsches and Lamborghinis? Once the 225/55VR15 and 275/55VR15 are in stock there shall be nothing keeping De Tomaso owners from purchasing them too.

The iron is hot, its time to strike. I hope your comments don't discourage anybody. I hope people will still email Dougal. If we want to be heard, we'll have to offer our input without waiting to be asked. We need to stir the pot and see what rises to the top. We can influence our own destinies, and squeaky wheels get greased. Sitting on our arses and doing nothing gets us nowhere.

That was and still is the purpose of this announcement.
George PGeorge PAdmin.
The 225/55 & 275/55 tire set was only 1/3 of my announcement. I asked those interested in the 285/50VR15 reissue to write in favor of that too. And I announced the impending availability of the wide body tire set. However, you seem focused on the 225/55 & 275/55 tire set.

I see no reason for the poll you suggested.

(1) No one has mentioned an alternative (amongst tires that can be reissued) to the 225/55VR15 and 275/55VR15 tire set, for the OEM wheels. There aren't multiple choices requiring a decision.
(2) Emails to Dougal are a type of statistic.
(3) Dougal hasn't asked for statistics.
(4) This is not an effort pushing for an all new tire set for the Pantera. Its simply a request for reissues, taking advantage of the fact that Pirelli are in the mood for reissues.
X xloMember
Perhaps it would be helpful if I threw my own personal experience out there. I purchased a batch of 30 pairs of Yokohama 285/40/VR15 when the opportunity arose about 4 years ago - at the time fronts for my GT5S were next to impossible to find and I figured they would be easy enough to resell. So, on the back of a few "I'd buy them's" I funded the venture myself - it took me 2 years to sell them and 90% went to Renault 5 Turbo owners.... In the end I profited to the tune of one free set for me. Would I bother again? I think not, and can totally see why there is significant reluctance to do this for pantera owners as a commercial venture.

Andy
joulesjoules"Racing is Life, anything before or after is just waiting" - Steve McQueen
Yeah if you read the reviews Naking haven't figured out how to make tires round yet. You get what you pay for!

This is a great thread or should I say 'tread', everyone wants a different tires size! And speaking of get what you pay for, that's before any mention of pricing. Just wait until it is announced these are $400+ a pop, then see the cats scatter quicker than throwing a Coyote in a Cattery
P peterfenlonMember
quote:
Originally posted by Joules:
Yeah if you read the reviews Naking haven't figured out how to make tires round yet. You get what you pay for!

This is a great thread or should I say 'tread', everyone wants a different tires size! And speaking of get what you pay for, that's before any mention of pricing. Just wait until it is announced these are $400+ a pop, then see the cats scatter quicker than throwing a Coyote in a Cattery


Your right of course Joules, the Nankangs were£67 each, other tyres of a better quality were from £450 to over£650 each.

I dont race and get my state pension, Not only do I get what I pay for, I also get what I can afford.

My wheels are Roin 10" alloy copies and are very nice too.
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