quote:The 400s unique motor mounts pose no problem since motor mount adapters are one of the easiest parts to fabricate in our hobby.
Yes, custom motor mounts and if you have even modest fab skills these are not a problem but it will take some time to mock them up with the engine in position and actually fab them. A good days work with everything apart maybe?
quote:Although the 400 has a different bell housing bolt pattern and different motor mount bosses than the 351C the drawbacks in using the 400 in the context of installation hassle are limited to the exhaust system and the engine screen. The 400 has the 385 series (429/460) bell housing bolt pattern, and a ZF bell housing for that application is available (some Pantera owners have equipped their cars with 385 series crate motors).
So what cost is assigned to acquiring a big block to -2 ZF patterned bell housing? Whatever it is, you’re out of pocket that much against your economy build. They’re not free and will be required if you are to have the non-FMX block to which you refer. Say $500-600 or more?
quote:That leaves fabrication or modification of headers to fit the 4V heads on a wider taller motor.
IMO, this seems to be a bit of an arm wave to me.
Yes, you will definitely need a custom exhaust. I think you will find it more involved than it might first appear. Sort of depends on what headers you start with but in my case, even with high port heads on a 9.5” block, which puts the port in a similar location to the 400 deck, I had to relocate the coolant tank because there was not sufficient clearance of #4 primary. This of course requires that you rework nearly all of your coolant plumbing. I also found it impractical to try to adapt garden variety Pantera headers as the collector on the passenger side was so much higher it created real challenges with the collector position, transition from the collector to tail pipe diameter, and being able to snake the tail pipe through the suspension. The driver’s side header also hit the gas tank heat shield. After returning a set of vendor supplied headers that were supposedly made for my combo, before I was done, it was purpose/scratch built headers and I went ahead and pieced together custom 2.5” tail pipes from mandrel bent tube back to the cans. I couldn’t get 3” through there and accommodate any suspension travel and it would not have done any good with GTS cans at the end of the trail anyway.
So in any event you might shell out >$150 for a header kit and spend a bunch of fab time on this portion of the swap.
quote:Intake manifold selection kind a sucks in my opinion,….
Ya-can-say-that-again.
quote:….but there are readily available adapter plates to allow installation of 351C 4V intake manifolds on the 400, which means you have the choice of using the classic 351C 4V intake manifolds including the Shelby/Blue Thunder manifold, the Holley Strip Dominator manifold and the Weiand tunnel ram.
I agree there are no suitable intakes available for this combo and the most practical solution to 4V head fitment to a 400 block are adapters as it gives a reasonable selection of 351C intakes although it has ugly written all over it when you’re done. I have seen people (me for example ;-)….) contour the adapters to match the scallops on the intakes to help with the aesthetics but it’s a bunch of work. You’ll be out $335 for the Price Motorsport #AP30 by the time they are shipped to you and they also will require port matching to the heads and intake so get out the die grinder and cartridge rolls for a few hours.
quote:Since the motor is taller, the engine screen will not fit without modification.
Yes, but this just a matter of taste on this one. Lot’s of Panteras running around without engine screens.
So do the stock Pantera alternator and A/C brackets/mounts work or do these require modification and/or custom fab work as well?
Anyway, I figure that you need to shell at least ~$1000 and a bunch of fab hours to adapt the “economy” 400 build to your 351c equipped Pantera. There are some skilled fabricators on this site that are doing this swap and doing it well. If you enjoy fab and don’t value your time I guess you don’t assign a value to this part of the swap and all-the power-to-you if that’s the case.
IMO you’d be better off taking the dough and applying it toward a 9.2” deck aftermarket block ($1200-1800 new, maybe better used), spend the bucks prepping this engine that you would have spent rebuilding the 400, buy a new bump stick, use your standard motor mounts, bell housing, accessory mounts, headers, avoid all the fab time, and call it a day. Any reasonable valuation of all that fab time buys a stroker kit and gets you comparable performance or more because you have a more solid short block to build power on than the 400 anyway.
And, when you’re all done, if you ever want to sell your car (I know, I know….its personal choice and this will never happen) you still get to explain the virtues of your 400 engine choice to any prospective buyers and those that value it will be few (I would contend devalue it).
I just don’t see the economy or advantage to it.
-Flame away.
Kelly