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Reply to "Info needed on Yates C3 heads and manifolds..."

Michael,

Unless you already have a set of Yates heads in your possession, or know where you can get a fantastic price on a set, or plan on building a new engine from scratch using a Windsor block, I do not advise using the Yates heads, because there are very good aternatives that are compatible with any Cleveland components, using all readily available, off the shelf, new parts.

The Yates head is really not a Cleveland head. The only thing it has in common with a Cleveland head is the bolt pattern, which is common to all Windsor & 335 series motors. It requires different pistons and specific Yates shaft mount rocker arm systems. The intake manifolds and exhaust manifolds are unique too.

One of the problems with the Yates heads is there are no Pantera headers available designed to mate with the Yates exhaust ports. Correction: Pat Mical sells Pantera headers for a Yates headed motor.

However, since Yates heads are not canted valve heads, the pistons in your Cleveland block will not work with Yates heads. Neither will the rocker arms/valve train.

The Yates C3 heads have very small combustion chambers, 40cc nominal. Too much compression for pump gas. The C3L heads have larger combustion chambers (67 cc nominal) and are a better choice for pump gas.

The only intake manifolds available are the single four barrell, high rise "spider" style intakes.

If the application is a street engine, you'll no doubt be using a cam with lift in the 0.600" range, the flow at higher lifts afforded by the race heads will not be utilized.

The ports in an out of the box Ford race head are very small, they are intended to be ported by each race team to the size, shape and configuration the race teams desire, it is actually very expensive to get a set of Ford race heads ready to bolt onto a short block.
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You haven't mentioned what the intended use of the motor/car will be. So its not possible to focus on what's best for your application. Here's six Cleveland compatible alternatives for anyone to consider:

1) the CHI, AFD or Edelbrock 2V heads

These are for the guy with a mildly tuned street motor, cams up to 0.600" lift. They bolt directly to a Cleveland short block stuffed with Cleveland pistons, will work with any 351C 2V intake manifold, there are some good manifolds to choose from including the Edelbrock Performer, the Edelbrock Air Gap, and the Parker Funnel Web-2V. The alloy 2V heads have exhaust ports compatible with 2V headers (I'm not sure if all 3 will work with 4V headers, but I know the CHI does). These heads are not for making maximum power, but they'll provide great throttle response, and with all out effort will surely support 600 BHP. Dennis Yogi has a set of the Edelbrock's on one of his Panteras. Sorry Dennis, I forget which one.

2) The good ol' CHI 3V head.

The CHI head is a Cleveland head, it bolts right onto a Cleveland short block using Cleveland pistons and Cleveland valve gear. 351C 4V headers will match up too. The intake ports are available in 3 different volumes. The smallest ports are best with a standard displacement motor. The mid size ports are best with a stroker motor. I don't know anyone using the big ports. CHI will advise you which port size to select based upon your motor and your intended use of your car. There are high rise intakes available, and a two plane single four barrel low rise intake too. Any 351C 2V intake can be mated to CHI 3V heads using spacers sold by CHI. These are max effort, serious street heads that can be used for amateur racing too. These heads will support at least 750 BHP, in other words, they are comparable to the cast iron 4V heads in ultimate capability. A whole bunch of Pantera owners are running CHI 3V heads, Art Stevens just built a motor using them.

3) The AFD "SP" (stuffed port) 4V head

Like the CHI head, the AFD head is a Cleveland head, it bolts right onto a Cleveland short block using Cleveland pistons and Cleveland valve gear. 351C 4V headers will again match up too. You don't have quite the intake manifold selection as you do with the CHI heads, but the Parker Funnel Web-4V is a direct bolt on. Like the CHI 3V head, this is a max effort serious street head. AFD has a much larger loyal following in Australia than they do here in North America.

4) The CHI 4V head.

Everything I wrote about the CHI 3V head applies here as well, EXCEPT any 351C 4V intake manifold will bolt to these heads. That gives an owner very many options, such as the Blue Thunder, the Holley Strip Dominator, the Edelbrock Torker, the individual runner Weber 48IDA intakes, the Ford D1ZX-9425-CA (spread bore) and D1ZX-9425-DA (Holley) intakes, and the Weiand, Edelbrock or Offenhauser tunnel ram intakes.

5) The Blue Thunder head.

The Blue Thunder head is a canted valve head that uses Yates high port intake manifolds. Its available with a choice of 3 different size intake ports, 2 different size combustion chambers and 2 different exhaust port locations. These are race heads capable of crazy air flow numbers with valve lifts in the 0.700"+ range.

Blue Thunder heads with the smallest intake port, the largest combustion chamber and the low exhaust port are a direct bolt on to your Cleveland short block because they are canted valve heads and will work with the Cleveland pistons. They use 351C valve train components. They will even mate with 351C 4V headers. Just purchase a readily available Yates high rise intake for a 9.2" deck short block and you are ready to rock and roll. David Berman has these heads on his motor.

6) The Brodix BF301 head.

This head is a dead ringer for the old high port Ford Motorsport/SVO C302 head. Its designed for canted valve valve train, therefore it bolts straight onto a Cleveland short block stuffed with Cleveland pistons. Cleveland valve train components also work with this head. Exhaust headers for this application are readily available from the Pantera vendors. Like the Blue Thunder head, these are race heads, and will produce large air flow numbers with porting and high (0.700"+) lift racing cams.

Edelbrock makes an intake manifold for these heads, the runners are rather aggressive (large) for street applications, and its designed for a Windsor block with a Windsor thermostat housing. It can be easily cut to fit the Cleveland block however, and the thermostat housing can be cut off for distributor clearance. You may be lucky and find a Ford SVO/Roush A331 intake on the used market which has appreciably smaller intake runners and is designed for the Cleveland block. Kelly C (Panterror) has these heads on his motor.

cowboy from hell
Last edited by George P
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