All, I found the problem.....bad ignition switch. Below is what I emailed back to Mike Drew and the Detomaso mail forum. Thanks everyone for the suggestions that helped me eliminate variables. What a great community we have and I'm very thankful for all of you : ) Regards, Mike
My mail exchange below with Mike Drew on the Detomaso mail forum:
Mike, your diagnosis was correct! Your method to test was spot on and the car fired right up when I held the ignition switch in the start position and used the remote starter to start it up. Thanks again to you and everyone who offered great troubleshooting suggestions.
Luckily I bought a brand new ignition switch 20 years ago at the San Diego swap meet when I live down there. Now I at least know the culprit to my problem and can make the swap.
I may try to rebuild the old switch based on the instructions I saw on Panteraplace. Com
Much happy now and ready to get on the road again. I know the world currently has larger problems than Panteras not starting but this car has always been a stress release for me and now I need it more than ever : ) Thanks again everyone! What a great community : ) Regards, Mike Reilly
From: Mike Reilly
Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2020 9:03 AM
To: Mike Drew
Cc: DeTomaso@server.detomasolist.com
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Pantera Won't Start but has fuel, spark, good timing etc. Baffled and need Advice
Mike, I have the original starter so your updated test is what I’ll try. I first need to obtain a remote starter. On the Forum Rocky had a good suggestion. Pasted below for all to see. I plan to try this as well. My Pantera is #7366 (Late 74) and it never had a ballast resistor but instead a light blue “resistance wire” which in 1993 when I installed the Duraspark system was told to disconnect as the Duraspark didn’t need it. When it was connected it was acting like a rev limiter. When removed the car ran great from 1993 until now so I don’t think that’s the issue. I plan to pursue the ignition switch first and then the duraspark box next. I think my coil if fine as I get a good spark. Thanks, Mike
From Rocky:
“A picture is worth a thousand words.
This schematic has been around for a while (He attached the Duraspark 2 wiring diagram in case the image doesn’t come through in the server mail).
Anyway - According to this, you should be able to just unplug the two wire connector from the Duraspark Box and check the connections at the Harness Side (not the Duraspark Module).
Check #1: The red wire should be "hot" when you have the ignition in the "RUN" position.
Check #2: The white wire should be "hot" when you are cranking the engine. According to what I read - the white wire is the Ignition Retard for ease of cranking.
OOPS - this schematic shows a ballast resistor!”
[cid:image001.png@01D62C29.012E2150]
From: Mike Drew<mailto:MikeLDrew@aol.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 16, 2020 10:32 PM
To: Mike Reilly<mailto:reillyms@live.com>
Cc: detomaso@server.detomasolist.com<mailto:detomaso@server.detomasolist.com>
Subject: Re: [DeTomaso] Pantera Won't Start but has fuel, spark, good timing etc. Baffled and need Advice
Mike,
I think my test advice below will only work if you have a modern starter with a built-in solenoid, that you can unplug at the starter. If you use the stock solenoid, and you unplug the wire from the switch to the solenoid, you can’t test to see if it will power the ignition. What you would have to do is unplug the red wire that is coming from the switch, and unplug the orange wire going from the other side of the solenoid to the ignition system, and hook them together, bypassing the solenoid entirely. That way, when you turn the key to the ‘run’ position, it powers the ignition only. And your remote starter would power the starter only.
Mike
Sent from my iPad
> On May 16, 2020, at 22:08, Mike Drew <MikeLDrew@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>> On May 16, 2020, at 21:53, Mike Reilly <reillyms@live.com> wrote:
>>
>> Sorry. Try this link: [1]https://eur04.safelinks.protec...D&reserved=0
>>
>>
>> Yeah, damn electrons! Yes, to clarify it will just crank and crank and
>> never seem to catch and start. Sorry for the confusion.
>>
>>>> That statement directly contradicts the video. The video clearly shows the car starting and running until the ignition key is released. Classic burned out switch symptom.
>>
>>> I didn't plan to swap the ignition switch yet but to test that the
>> wires were getting and sending juice in both the "start" and "on"
>> mode. I also agree that I may just need to start replacing things
>> electronic if all testing fails. My ignition system (the whole
>> Duraspark) is old as I bought it from Hall in 1993!
>
>>>> Well, the motor runs when the ignition switch is powering it, in the start position. That eliminates everything downstream of the switch as a culprit. If you had a Duraspark problem I imagine it would just crank and crank and never fire at all.
>>
>>
>>> I probably also need to get a remote starter switch as my current
>> "remote starter" e.g. my wife is losing interest : (
>>
>>>> With a remote starter and the key on, the car will probably crank and crank and not ever fire.
>
> Try this:
>
> Disconnect the wire from the key on the starter solenoid. Now when you turn the key to start, the starter doesn’t do anything. Hook your remote starter up to the solenoid instead. When you pull the trigger with the key off, the car will turn over as the starter operates, but the car won’t run.
>
> Try again with the key in the ‘run’ position. Probably the same result.
>
> THEN, try again with the key HELD in the spring-loaded ‘start’ position. The key won’t activate the starter because the wire is disconnected. But with the key held in the start position, that alternate ignition source will power the ignition system, and then you will probably be able to start the car with your remote starter. It should run until the key is released back to ‘run’ at which point it will quit.
>
> That will confirm the diagnosis.....
>
> Mike