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I can't find the pics. Where did you put them?
quote:Originally posted by PanteraDoug:
I can't find the pics. Where did you put them?
or here:
http://groups.msn.com/InsearchofABetterParadise/73panteraforsale.msnw
Excellent series of photos - the best I've seen.
But if this is a $53K car, prices have REALLY gone up.
A clean, maintained, good looking car. But brakes, cooling, suspension, interior, clutch system, exhaust all appear mostly/completely stock. And chassis mileage is not really low.
Just my 2¢. Others?
Larry
But if this is a $53K car, prices have REALLY gone up.
A clean, maintained, good looking car. But brakes, cooling, suspension, interior, clutch system, exhaust all appear mostly/completely stock. And chassis mileage is not really low.
Just my 2¢. Others?
Larry
Looks to be a clean well maintained turn key car, I don't fell the price is out of hand. Seems a bargain to a non car guy that wants something cool fun and exotic, without having to reinvent the wheel after purchase. You could buy that car on Friday, and place at most car shows that Sunday.
Not bagging Larry, but I think Pantera owners are our own worst enemy when it come to current values.
The cars turn heads, they're cool,and a blast to drive. People put a value on that, if we don't put value on them, why should the buying public? Which would your rather drive a Hemi Cuda, or the Pantera?(Note: I didn't ask which you'd rather own lol) I've driven both, and prefer the Pantera., so what makes the Cuda worth 500,000 and the Pantera 35,000 ?
Just my 2
Sorry for the flame Larry, just had to get that off my chest.
Mark 6808
Not bagging Larry, but I think Pantera owners are our own worst enemy when it come to current values.
The cars turn heads, they're cool,and a blast to drive. People put a value on that, if we don't put value on them, why should the buying public? Which would your rather drive a Hemi Cuda, or the Pantera?(Note: I didn't ask which you'd rather own lol) I've driven both, and prefer the Pantera., so what makes the Cuda worth 500,000 and the Pantera 35,000 ?
Just my 2
Sorry for the flame Larry, just had to get that off my chest.
Mark 6808
I tend to agree with you Mark.
I've never seen a group like this that talks down the value of thier own cars.
I just don't understand that thinking.
I've never seen a group like this that talks down the value of thier own cars.
I just don't understand that thinking.
I have a lot of friends into Cougars, and I see it there as well. Cougars (the special models anyway) are starting to climb in value. They were one of those last holdouts and really a better deal than a Mustang because at least you knew you'd get a V8 and nicer interior for less.
On the other side of the question, is a 'cuda worth $500,000? I'd have to say not in a million years.
On the other side of the question, is a 'cuda worth $500,000? I'd have to say not in a million years.
I agree. We are our own worst enemy when it comes to promoting the car and its value. There are some lucky-find cheap buys out there but they are clearly the exception and take a lot of work to find them.
Escalating prices are the best thing that will ever happen to the cars. When prices are getting better, new owners will be much more inclined to buy the cars, creating even more demand. Old owners will be much more willing to spend the money necessary to upgrade and restore their cars properly. This will also keep the vendors in business. (As an aside, there are true enthusiasts who are maintaining and restoring their cars well. We are a small majority unfortunately. We probably hang out here, too.)
When prices were going nowhere, people were not investing and when they did they did it cheaply. Now, all those old poorly done mods/upgrades/rebuilds are part of the problem in finding good cars. Who knows what you'll get.
Another thing that bugs me is the way we always start right in with the negatives and problems when we talk with other people. There are way too many positives that we s/b talking about first. As my dear old Mum used to say, "If you don't have anything good to say, then don't say anything at all."
Escalating prices are the best thing that will ever happen to the cars. When prices are getting better, new owners will be much more inclined to buy the cars, creating even more demand. Old owners will be much more willing to spend the money necessary to upgrade and restore their cars properly. This will also keep the vendors in business. (As an aside, there are true enthusiasts who are maintaining and restoring their cars well. We are a small majority unfortunately. We probably hang out here, too.)
When prices were going nowhere, people were not investing and when they did they did it cheaply. Now, all those old poorly done mods/upgrades/rebuilds are part of the problem in finding good cars. Who knows what you'll get.
Another thing that bugs me is the way we always start right in with the negatives and problems when we talk with other people. There are way too many positives that we s/b talking about first. As my dear old Mum used to say, "If you don't have anything good to say, then don't say anything at all."
I agree Jeff. You always see car guys in different avenues discussing car prices. When the prices of current cars goes up they all group together and say it ain't worth the price; yet it is if people are paying it. People are always comparing apples to oranges too. People say a Cuda is not worth 500K but it's not all Cuda's worth 500K and not all Pantera's are 35K. Locally a very nice Challenger with a 318; which is very similar, in very good shape had been for sale for around 15K with no buyers for quite some time.
Gary
Gary
To each his own, obviously. I wouldn't want a 318 Challenger either, unless I was ready to swap in a 440.
The only real problem with escalating prices is that less people can afford the car. I didn't pay squat for mine, but it will cost an armload to do to it what it needs. Bad money decision, but hey, its what I had to do and hopefully I'll have it forever, or at least a real long time. I couldn't have afforded to buy one too much nicer.
The only real problem with escalating prices is that less people can afford the car. I didn't pay squat for mine, but it will cost an armload to do to it what it needs. Bad money decision, but hey, its what I had to do and hopefully I'll have it forever, or at least a real long time. I couldn't have afforded to buy one too much nicer.
I put way more money in my MGB then what it will be worth. At least the Pantera will be worth a lot closer to what I invest in restoration. What happens with the MG's is when people restore them, all the guys say you have to be fools to do so and the MG community is full of rough MG's. Some one is always selling a "Restored" MG with a freshly overhauled engine and 30yr paint for $3k and a load of old guys telling you they paid $800 for theirs and only a fool would pay $3K for it.
Then there are a few who put fair money back into these cars to bring them back up to what they were. There is nothing wrong with a truly restored and desired car that has some monetary value.
Then there are a few who put fair money back into these cars to bring them back up to what they were. There is nothing wrong with a truly restored and desired car that has some monetary value.
Oh, I agree. And I like to think I got a good deal, but you know how that goes.
Truely it is whatever the market will bare and we shouldn't talk down the prices. Even tho I will spend more than I should, I'll end up with what I want, which is part of the beauty of it.
Truely it is whatever the market will bare and we shouldn't talk down the prices. Even tho I will spend more than I should, I'll end up with what I want, which is part of the beauty of it.
When I was looking to buy a Pantera in the mid 1990's prices seemed unusually low. Whe I bought, an average 'sorted' car was $25K.
3-4 years ago I felt the average car was much closer to $35K. Mike Drew generally disagreed with me. We would go inspect a car for a potential buyer and I would generally place it's value several K above Mike's estimate.
I don't know if Mike has raised his guess at an "average" price since 2003, but I'd say it has risen closer to $40K.
I watch a lot of cars change hands, most closer to this price than say $30K.
Owning is OK, DRIVING is GOOD !
Chuck
Now I think
3-4 years ago I felt the average car was much closer to $35K. Mike Drew generally disagreed with me. We would go inspect a car for a potential buyer and I would generally place it's value several K above Mike's estimate.
I don't know if Mike has raised his guess at an "average" price since 2003, but I'd say it has risen closer to $40K.
I watch a lot of cars change hands, most closer to this price than say $30K.
Owning is OK, DRIVING is GOOD !
Chuck
Now I think
Chuck you make me feel good. I paid Mike Drew dollars. It has a rebuilt motor, a little rust and ok paint. I can drive it. I can't argue with what I paid. I guess that's all that matters.
quote:Originally posted by Chuck Melton:
When I was looking to buy a Pantera in the mid 1990's prices seemed unusually low. Whe I bought, an average 'sorted' car was $25K.
3-4 years ago I felt the average car was much closer to $35K. Mike Drew generally disagreed with me. We would go inspect a car for a potential buyer and I would generally place it's value several K above Mike's estimate.
I don't know if Mike has raised his guess at an "average" price since 2003, but I'd say it has risen closer to $40K.
I watch a lot of cars change hands, most closer to this price than say $30K.
Owning is OK, DRIVING is GOOD !
Chuck
Now I think
I tend to agree with you more Mr. Melton. I don't think others have malicious intent in underestimating values, it is more they remembered what they paid for such and such, and by golly it was ten years ago. ONce you get a Pantera time speeds up. It is like when you were a kid summers seemed to last forever. But now time seems to go faster and summers rush by. Panteras are like time machines in they speed your life up because it sure doesn't seem like ten years since I bought mine. I look at it in the garage and it still seems new and exciting. With so many things to do, car shows, repairs, going on stress relieving drives, time goes faster. It is like my wife always says...
"One thing lead to another, and before you knew it, we were all dead."
My wife is real phylisophical. She also says "I think, therefore I know."