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Classic or Sports?

G Guest
One thing I have always questioned to myself is what is a Pantera in the eyes of many.
Is it a classic car? Regardless of a high level of investment, will never be on par with a modern day sports car. Or, would you say quite simply say that a sports car is parked in your garage , with no mention of its age.
I'm sure most owners have often wandered what exactly they own as stupid as it sounds. If i was to ask myself the question now, i'm not sure if I could give a fair and accurate answer to the question.
Your thoughts ?
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D detom (Guest)
IMHO the Patera is a classic exotic car. Yes there are sports cars now a days that can out perorm it. However, if you bought one of those, say a brand new Corvette, since it costs about what a good Pantera costs, and you drive it off the lot, you will lose thousands of dollars that first day. In other words a Pantera is going up in value, while the Corvette will continue to go down for perhaps decades to come. Therefore, the Pantera is a classic, an investment grade purchase, while the Corvette, may or may not some day become a classic, and is a garunteed loss at least for many decades.
So also think about Ferraris. Some continue to go down in purchase price. Like the 308. Now I don't see them going any lower than they are right now, but it will be a long time to come before you see a 308 really start to climb. There are no garunteed classic cars. Only the test of time identifies which are and which are not.
joulesjoules"Racing is Life, anything before or after is just waiting" - Steve McQueen
From most reactions to the car I would say that most of the general public don't even consider it may be 30+ years old and even I forget sometimes Smiler The public probably consider it more an 'Exotic Sports'

I have only had my P car 4 months and have only been out in it a couple times so far, but I have had a lot of different reactions;

"What is it?"
"Is it a kit car?"
"Oh a Pantera, I haven't seen one of those since I was a kid"
"....." This is the one with the guy just stood mouth wide open drooling and looking like he was going to wet his pants any minute Big Grin

That is the beauty of a Pantera; It is something different to everyone whom sees it.

Julian
D detom (Guest)
quote:
"Is it a kit car?"

For me this is real hard. I am so tempted to just say "No it isn't a kit. I built it all by hand in my garage. Every curve, every feature was built with my own two hands. Why do you like it?? If you do I will build one just for you for, oh, maybe a million dollars."
George PGeorge PAdmin.
The design dates to 1969, manufacture began in 1970, it was assembled in Italy, it is a 2 passenger car designed for high performance. So I think "classis Italian sports car" fits the bill.

It is mid-engined, low, powerful, made in small numbers, rarely seen on the road, with alluring - sexy coachwork. So yes, exotic fits as well.

The Pantera has some deTomaso siblings: the Vellelunga, Mangusta, Longchamp, Deauville and Guara. So its "just" one of many cars assembled by deTomaso, a small Italian car maker.

Then there's the kinship the car shares with other Ford powered sports cars: the Cobra, the GT40, the new GT, the sunbeam Tiger, the Noble, the Saleen S7. It is most certainly a Ford powered sports car.

It shares a kinship with the Lamborghini Espada & Miura, as all 3 cars had Dallara designed chassis. Today Dallara is a very big name in race car chassis design.

It also shares a kinship with several Maserati cars: the Bora, Merak, Khamsin, Kyalami, Quattroporte, Bi Turbo, Spider, Racing, Shamal and Ghibli; as these cars were all sold by Maserati while Mr deTomaso was at the helm.

It shares a kinship with Tjaarda designed vehicles as well. Mr Tjaarda has had a long, prolific career, I can't begin to list the many projects he's been involved with, but among the classic sports cars he designed are the Ferrari 365 California, Fiat 124 Spider and Mercedes 230 SL Pininfarina Coupe.

I tell people its Italian, built in Modena just like Ferraris, they nod knowingly, it looks like a Ferrari. Then I tell them its a 1974 model, that floors them. Then they comment, "I bet it really goes" or "I'll bet its fun to drive" and I'll reply "yeah, I'm very fortunate. Wanna go for a ride?" Their faces light up so big! Or I'll tell the kids to ask their parents if it's ok that they sit in the car, mom always shows up with a camera!

BITCHEN!
Last edited by George P
B bulldog (Guest)
quote:
Originally posted by george pence:
The design dates to 1969, manufacture began in 1970, it was assembled in Italy, it is a 2 passenger car designed for high performance. So I think "classis Italian sports car" fits the bill.

It is mid-engined, low, powerful, made in small numbers, rarely seen on the road, with alluring - sexy coachwork. So yes, exotic fits as well.

The Pantera has some deTomaso siblings: the Vellelunga, Mangusta, Longchamp, Deauville and Guara. So its "just" one of many cars assembled by deTomaso, a small Italian car maker.

Then there's the kinship the car shares with other Ford powered sports cars: the Cobra, the GT40, the new GT, the sunbeam Tiger, the Noble, the Saleen S7. It is most certainly a Ford powered sports car.

It shares a kinship with the Lamborghini Espada & Miura, as all 3 cars had Dallara designed chassis. Today Dallara is a very big name in race car chassis design.

It also shares a kinship with several Maserati cars: the Bora, Merak, Khamsin, Kyalami, Quattroporte, Bi Turbo, Spider, Racing, Shamal and Ghibli; as these cars were all sold by Maserati while Mr deTomaso was at the helm.

It shares a kinship with Tjaarda designed vehicles as well. Mr Tjaarda has had a long, prolific career, I can't begin to list the many projects he's been involved with, but among the classic sports cars he designed are the Ferrari 365 California, Fiat 124 Spider and Mercedes 230 SL Pininfarina Coupe.

I tell people its Italian, built in Modena just like Ferraris, they nod knowingly, it looks like a Ferrari. Then I tell them its a 1974 model, that floors them. Then they comment, "I bet it really goes" or "I'll bet its fun to drive" and I'll reply "yeah, I'm very fortunate. Wanna go for a ride?" Their faces light up so big! Or I'll tell the kids to ask their parents if it's ok that they sit in the car, mom always shows up with a camera!

No one tells it the way you do. Another great lesson, thanks.

BITCHEN!
jeff6559jeff6559Member
Technically, I believe it is a Grand Touring (Gran Tourismo?) Car. However...

A classic mid-engined Italian sports car that ran circles around its contemporaries in the 70's, including Ferraris. Somehow you gotta get the Ferrari in there cause then they automatically understand. (contemporaries include cars of similar cost, ie, Dino, 308, XKE, Corvette, etc.)

Jeff
6559
K korina (Guest)
I don't think you can consider a Pantera a classic car. I think by definition a classic car needs to be older than 1948. Something like a Cord, Bugatti or a Dusenberg is a classic car. 16 cylinder Caddys and 12 cylinder Lincolns qualify. You might be able to call a Pantera a collectable car although I think there are some hoops to jump thought there too. It's a collectable like an old Mustang or some of the more common Vettes. That's fine with me. They're just great cars that never really reached their potential. The rest of the car world's loss is our gain. If Panteras became like Hemi Cudas, Yenko's or some Corvettes, we couldn't enjoy them like we do. What good is that? I drove my car to work twice this week. What a great feeling to go screaming down to tollway with thw windows open listening to the Cleveland Symphony Orchestra. It doesn't get much better than that.
K korina (Guest)
I'm right behind you there, I assuming our ages anyway. I can't believe that soon I'll qualify for an AARP card. I wonder how many of us remember when Panteras first came out? I remember when I saw my first one. It was behind my school bus. I still think they're one of the most beautiful cars ever made. It's a classic to me if that means anything.
markcharltonmarkcharltonOld enough to know better and still young enough not to care. My '71 Pantera
I think George hit it bang-on "a bitchin' classic Italian exotic sports car"

Technically, (here, anyway) anything older than 25 years qualifies as an "antique" according to our vehicle registrar. The CCCA considers a classic to be a significant car built between 1925 and 1948: A CCCA Classic is a "fine" or "distinctive" automobile, either American or foreign built, produced between 1925 and 1948. That's what I consider to be "bronze-age" not classic... Big Grin

I can’t see how one could argue the Pantera isn’t a “classic”, but I’ll NEVER see it as an antique. (my 2¢)
D detom (Guest)
quote:
Originally posted by korina:
I'm right behind you there, I assuming our ages anyway. I can't believe that soon I'll qualify for an AARP card. I wonder how many of us remember when Panteras first came out? I remember when I saw my first one. It was behind my school bus. I still think they're one of the most beautiful cars ever made. It's a classic to me if that means anything.

I was in college. Some of my classmates went with me down to the Licoln Mercury dealer to check out all the hub-bub. Beutiful car. Incredible to look at. But who in there right mind would pay over ten thousand dollars for a car????
jeff6559jeff6559Member
quote:
Originally posted by DeTom:
But who in there right mind would pay over ten thousand dollars for a car????


I did. And I thought it was a good buy!

At the time, the comparable cars were: Ferrari Dino - slow and several thou more expensive; Ferrari 308 - slow and not very good looking, expensive and fiberglas; XKE - at the end of it's useful life and not like it used to be; Corvettes - smogged, slow and for the gold chain crowd; Porsche - the only real competition and about the same or slightly less price, but not quite so fast, beautiful, or interesting technically; there was 6 cylinder Maser which I can't remember (Merak?) but it was slow, ugly and powered by a Peugeot or Citreon drivetrain; Lotus - slow and always broken.

The next step up were the true exotics: Bora - $30 thou for a car that was technically just like the Pantera, right down to the ZF tranny, and no better performance; Ferrari 365 GT/4 Berlinetta Boxer - ultra performance and cost to match but not much faster off the line; Lambo Countach - same.

The only negatives to the Pantera were most people didn't really know about them, the car mags for some reason never took to them so they got kind of a bad rap, the sports car crowd looked down their noses at them because they were not true Italians (Ford engine).

The thing I still have trouble with, even today, is the car magazines attitude toward the car. It truly was a bargain in it's day. They just never got it.

So what else was there to buy if you were 25 and into sports cars?

Jeff
6559
D detom (Guest)
quote:
So what else was there to buy if you were 25 and into sports cars?

Uhm, a house???? I was a starving college student, having to roll my own cigareets to get buy. Ten grand back at that time was an enormous amount of money. A brand new 454 Corvette with evey option on it was $7500. Yes I would have loved to have had a Pantera, but I was from the wrong side of the tracks. All I could afford was a Firebird.
panteradougpanteradougMember
I think that the car is a Classic Exotic High Performance Sports Car.
Classics never get old, they are timeless. The Pantera was ahead of it's time. It answered a question that nobody asked.
It is not a car for everyone. It is a car for the very few that understand, that have vision, and that appreciate the intangables in life.
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