I'd like to replace the original coilover setup on 6927, and would like some feedback as to what adjustable setups have worked, who has them out there....etc. (Koni, Bilstein, Eibach.....etc).
Bob
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quote:
Originally posted by kaamacat:
I'd like to replace the original coilover setup on 6927, and would like some feedback as to what adjustable setups have worked, who has them out there....etc. (Koni, Bilstein, Eibach.....etc).
Bob
Carrera Shocks are excellent and are available from the Pantera vendors.
Mike
Mike. Thanks for the input.
Do you know if they come in a "std" package. (ie. 4shocks, coils, and coil adjusters)?
Bob
Do you know if they come in a "std" package. (ie. 4shocks, coils, and coil adjusters)?
Bob
Hall Sell them
Think about your driving habits and your handling needs when selecting your equipment. The spring rates will effect not only your ability to handle corners but also ride height and comfort for normal driving. I�ve asked many people what spring rates they use and have heard 300lb to 500lb in front and 450lb to 700lb in the rear.
I've been using Koni's for many years as an upgrade from stock and love them. Carrera's are an improvement over the Konis but I'm not so sure the performance increase is commensurate with the much higher price tag.
I'm not sure, but I don't think you can get Koni's anymore??? I've had them for a while now.
I'm not sure, but I don't think you can get Koni's anymore??? I've had them for a while now.
Thanks for the inputs. Guess if I also knew the rates, travel, and install heights...etc I could call Eibach and see what they carry for a spring, and Koni or Bilstein for shocks. (and I only mention that because Ive got a Bilstein/Eibach set on my 928 made for it special with a progressive rate spring that is outstanding. Not bad for "daily driver" and super on the track).
Bob
Bob
Aldan shocks are also very good. They supply at least one vendor. I believe
the website is: http://www.aldaneagle.com
(The package is shock & spring).
Spring rate can e a personal preference...
Chuck
the website is: http://www.aldaneagle.com
(The package is shock & spring).
Spring rate can e a personal preference...
Chuck
Be aware that none of the adjustable coil-over shock sets are truely bolt-on-and-drive-away. There's considerable work involved in setting the car up so its at least as good as what you have as-stock, and the heights of all 4 corners are acceptible for driving streets in your area.. This is easiest done with a four-corner weighing system such as Longacre. Most real race teams have a set that you might be able to rent time on, or the Pantera shops also own sets. What you're trying for is equal weights on both fronts and both rear tires, which will not be the case when you first add the new coil-overs. Then, you just start walking around the car, first adjusting the right-front (which will affect the left-rear and the left front weights). If you're careful, a sack the same weight as the normal driver will be in the drivers seat and the gas tank will be half-full during this exercise. Setting the ride height and corner weights is a matter of infinite repetition until the corner weights are as close as you can get them. I've seen this phase take half a day. Once done, re-align the wheels to your desired specs since the height adjustments will have altered that setting likely both front & rear. Now its time to set the bounce & rebound values on each shock, with a short drive after each adjustment. I'd suggest setting both fronts the same, and both rears the same, to prevent weird handling in bumpy corners. Adjustable coil-overs are very similar to pro race-car stuff and the proper set-up procedure is identical, if you hope to take advantage of your expensive new parts.
Jack. Thanks. Yea I know what you mean about time and such. I suspect that unless you get the exact same height, at a minimum the camber is affected, along with (like you said) it takes time as one change affects the other 3. (I actually did what you mentioned on my 928, adding weight to the drivers seat). That car is/was a pain, as you've got to run it 5miles or so to get it to squat back down after its raised.
I did speak with Pantera Performance (Dennis), sounds like he has something I might want to try.
.........thanks for the feedback buddy!!
Bob
I did speak with Pantera Performance (Dennis), sounds like he has something I might want to try.
.........thanks for the feedback buddy!!
Bob
Right, Bob. The biggest problem with most 33-yr-old Panteras is, the subframe to which the chassis mounts are connected, has "relaxed" over the years, so even the stock coil-overs are all catty-wampus as far as corner- weights are concerned. And the main culprit in this is the pitiful stock 'camber bar' above the bellhousing. This thing typically moves in its slotted holes under any bumps, thus doing nothing to help hold the rear chassis together. Evidence of this is the huge negative camber on rear wheels on most cars. The cheap steel adjustable camber bar sold by many vendors will help restore rear end integrity, since the load with this bar is carried by the bar ends jamming into the rear fenderwell pockets; the bolts only keep it from popping out. The more expensive aluminum bars are shorter & mount exactly like a stock bar, IMHO doing nothing to help stability. Once the chassis is stable, you have a chance to set your new coil-overs and the adjustment will last a while.The various frt & rear stiffener-bar setups also help hold adjustments and vastly improve handling while maybe preventing paint cracking.
Hi:
I have a set of orange Konis I took off my '72 that are in very nice condition - just a grease spot or two on their orange paint, that's all. I replaced them with some aluminum shocks and, to be honest, I couldn't feel $1,000+ worth of difference in the ride or handling. They were just a little stiff before they got warmed up. I'm I'm in the LA area (they're heavy for shipping). Not sure what they're worth - will have to research their values, but make me an offer if you're interested. I'll also look and see if I can tell the spring rates.
Matt Merritt
mmerritt@eventvehicles.com
I have a set of orange Konis I took off my '72 that are in very nice condition - just a grease spot or two on their orange paint, that's all. I replaced them with some aluminum shocks and, to be honest, I couldn't feel $1,000+ worth of difference in the ride or handling. They were just a little stiff before they got warmed up. I'm I'm in the LA area (they're heavy for shipping). Not sure what they're worth - will have to research their values, but make me an offer if you're interested. I'll also look and see if I can tell the spring rates.
Matt Merritt
mmerritt@eventvehicles.com
My 71 (that I bought in 1983 then placed in storage for 14 years) had Koni shocks on it that I believe were an exact replacement for the originals. These shocks froze up solid so they became like a solid link (made for a rough ride) because of a design flaw according to Koni. I sent them off to Koni in Kentucky and they repaired the design flaw and rebuilt the shocks for $100 each. Koni told me they do not make shocks for the Pantera any more so any Koni shock you buy must be something that has been adapted to fit.
[This message has been edited by BD (edited 01-10-2004).]
[This message has been edited by BD (edited 01-10-2004).]
Regarding Koni shocks for Panteras- the original late-'70s Konis were made for the car carrying p/n 82-1701-SP-1(front) & 82-1601-SP-1 for the rears. These excellent shocks went out of production in the mid-'80s but Koni will still overhaul them, free if you were the original buyer & have your receipt. Koni also made similar shocks for the Mangusta, and low-pressure gas shocks with external adjustment for damping that were used by some Pantera owners. Don't have the p/n for these gas-charged units.
OK. Time now for the spring rates.
I'll want to order this week, and if asked what spring rates...........?
The car has a Group5 kit on it along with the delta wing. I would like to run it in an AutoX (or 2,3...), but, I dont want an overly rought ride. (and yes, I want my cake too)
So with that in mind what would be a good front and rear? (350/500)....Or are these just coming one-way depending on the vendor chosen?
.......THANKS......Bob (broke Bob soon)
I'll want to order this week, and if asked what spring rates...........?
The car has a Group5 kit on it along with the delta wing. I would like to run it in an AutoX (or 2,3...), but, I dont want an overly rought ride. (and yes, I want my cake too)
So with that in mind what would be a good front and rear? (350/500)....Or are these just coming one-way depending on the vendor chosen?
.......THANKS......Bob (broke Bob soon)