Well, I weighed my two 164 tooth flywheels on a shipping scale today.
The Billet Steel Centerforce SFI Flywheel weighs 34.19 Pounds.
The McLeod Aluminum Flywheel weighs 13.55 pounds
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Thanks Mark for doing it.
That's quite a bit of difference.
That's quite a bit of difference.
quote:Originally posted by Mark Mensen:
Well, I weighed my two 164 tooth flywheels on a shipping scale today.
The Billet Steel Centerforce SFI Flywheel weighs 34.19 Pounds.
The McLeod Aluminum Flywheel weighs 13.55 pounds
Ditto Mark, thanks for taking the time to weigh the parts & post the info for us.
your friend on the DTBB, George
your friend on the DTBB, George
My lightened steel flywheel weighs in at 26 pounds. Kind of in between.
Forest,
How did you go about lightening your flywheel.
Dennis
How did you go about lightening your flywheel.
Dennis
Coz,
Is that 13 lb flywheel what you're running?
Is that 13 lb flywheel what you're running?
Yes Dennis.
quote:Originally posted by 4NFORD:
Coz,
Is that 13 lb flywheel what you're running?
...I just weighed My Spare Flywheel on a very accurate digital scale. It's the original 'Full Weight' Steel flywheel that the factory installed on the engine with this Pantera (74L). The weight was exactly 30.0 LBS. When I put the new Engine in, I installed a Brand New Ford flywheel. I stayed with the Heavy Steel because I like it Heavy. I am Not knocking the Aluminum, nor do I wish to offend anybody. I personally do not need that 'instant' of a throttle response. What I know is; The lighter flywheel revs fast, also the revs 'fall off' fast; especially between shifts. I realize many of you who have installed these Aluminum pieces, will tell me that this is not true; perhaps you can shift very fast before the revs drop off or you just keep your foot into the accelerator, more, between shifts. We know the flywheel 'stores' energy and this is most usefull, and will be realized when driving up a steep hill or mountain. I would be curious to know what exactly the different results would be in 'Gas Milage'. I once heard a Girl ask "Who the heck would ever want to drive up a hill FAST?!" My answer would be, sometimes you'll find yourself driving hard and flat out, and you'll just happen to come to a Mountain. Just my opinion, don't take offense...
Marlin,
I could not detect any loss in drivability in Coz's Pantera, and the improvements in response were subtle but noticable. The car has more of a sports car feel to it, I liked it.
Of course, today I was cruising around Fillmore in second gear, barely above idle. Keeping it in second at stop signs & taking off in second when it was my turn to go. I might not get away with such lazy driving with a lightened flywheel.
The world, and the Pantera community, are big enough for owners to have different preferences in the way their cars perform. I doubt anyone takes offense Marlin.
I'll be headed to Escalon some time next week, to spend a day with my mother before Christmas. And I'm headed for Visalia right now. Take care.
Your friend on the DTBB, George
I could not detect any loss in drivability in Coz's Pantera, and the improvements in response were subtle but noticable. The car has more of a sports car feel to it, I liked it.
Of course, today I was cruising around Fillmore in second gear, barely above idle. Keeping it in second at stop signs & taking off in second when it was my turn to go. I might not get away with such lazy driving with a lightened flywheel.
The world, and the Pantera community, are big enough for owners to have different preferences in the way their cars perform. I doubt anyone takes offense Marlin.
I'll be headed to Escalon some time next week, to spend a day with my mother before Christmas. And I'm headed for Visalia right now. Take care.
Your friend on the DTBB, George
No offense taken Marlin.
I used to think what you think until I actually tried one. Rev's don't drop off all that fast and with the faster rate of climb, it's still a gain overall. No problem driving uphill and my gas mileage has gone up 2 miles to the gallon.
I personally would never go back to steel. But that's just my opinion. As George stated, I like the sports car feel I have now compared to the feel of the steel one I used to have.
We're all different in what we expect and want to feel from our cars, that's what's makes us all individuals and different from the rest...
Merry Christmas Marlin !
[QUOTE]Originally posted by MARLIN JACK: I am Not knocking the Aluminum, nor do I wish to offend anybody. I personally do not need that 'instant' of a throttle response. What I know is; The lighter flywheel revs fast, also the revs 'fall off' fast; especially between shifts. I realize many of you who have installed these Aluminum pieces, will tell me that this is not true; perhaps you can shift very fast before the revs drop off or you just keep your foot into the accelerator, more, between shifts. We know the flywheel 'stores' energy and this is most usefull, and will be realized when driving up a steep hill or mountain.
I used to think what you think until I actually tried one. Rev's don't drop off all that fast and with the faster rate of climb, it's still a gain overall. No problem driving uphill and my gas mileage has gone up 2 miles to the gallon.
I personally would never go back to steel. But that's just my opinion. As George stated, I like the sports car feel I have now compared to the feel of the steel one I used to have.
We're all different in what we expect and want to feel from our cars, that's what's makes us all individuals and different from the rest...
Merry Christmas Marlin !
[QUOTE]Originally posted by MARLIN JACK: I am Not knocking the Aluminum, nor do I wish to offend anybody. I personally do not need that 'instant' of a throttle response. What I know is; The lighter flywheel revs fast, also the revs 'fall off' fast; especially between shifts. I realize many of you who have installed these Aluminum pieces, will tell me that this is not true; perhaps you can shift very fast before the revs drop off or you just keep your foot into the accelerator, more, between shifts. We know the flywheel 'stores' energy and this is most usefull, and will be realized when driving up a steep hill or mountain.
Any thoughts on lightening a steel flywheel to say maybe 20 lbs to get an in between feel? Anyone tried it?
I would imagine it could be done by drilling holes outside the diameter of the pressure plate. But I would also think that you would have to drill so many holes around the flywheel that it would lose a lot of it's strength and could very well crack and come apart under load.
I wouldn't want to take that chance considering where it sits in relation to the bell housing and gear box.
I wouldn't want to take that chance considering where it sits in relation to the bell housing and gear box.
quote:Originally posted by 4NFORD:
Any thoughts on lightening a steel flywheel to say maybe 20 lbs to get an in between feel? Anyone tried it?
The flywheel and the pressure plate create an assembly that weighs at least 60 pounds, substituting an alloy flywheel weighing 15 pounds less amounts to only a 25% reduction in weight of the assembly.
Keep in mind, your Cleveland flywheel is designed with a 28 ounce imbalance, not a good idea to go machining it and destroying the 28 ounce imbalance built into it.
There should be flywheels of various weight commercially available, it is a tool used by race car designers to dial in a chassis.
your friend on the DTBB, George
Keep in mind, your Cleveland flywheel is designed with a 28 ounce imbalance, not a good idea to go machining it and destroying the 28 ounce imbalance built into it.
There should be flywheels of various weight commercially available, it is a tool used by race car designers to dial in a chassis.
your friend on the DTBB, George
George,
If your crank was balanced, why would want to run a 28oz inbalanced flywheel ?
[QUOTE]Keep in mind, your Cleveland flywheel is designed with a 28 ounce imbalance, not a good idea to go machining it and destroying the 28 ounce imbalance built into it.
If your crank was balanced, why would want to run a 28oz inbalanced flywheel ?
[QUOTE]Keep in mind, your Cleveland flywheel is designed with a 28 ounce imbalance, not a good idea to go machining it and destroying the 28 ounce imbalance built into it.
the oem crankshaft from Ford is designed for "external" balance, hence your harmonic balancer and flywheel have counterweights cast into them, putting them in a state of imbalance, these counterweights become integral to the balance of the crankshaft. As an assembly, the crankshaft with the flywheel & balancer attached, is in a state of balance.
This is good enough for operation to 7500 rpm. Racers wanting to run the engine harder either purchase an "internally" balanced crankshaft, or have the oem crank internally balanced with the use of slugs of "mallory metal". Balancers and flywheels designed for internally balanced motors do not have counterweights cast into them, they are themselves in a state of balance.
clear as mud? If I was home I could throw some pictures up for you, but I'm in Visalia this weekend.
your imbalanced friend on & off the DTBB, George
This is good enough for operation to 7500 rpm. Racers wanting to run the engine harder either purchase an "internally" balanced crankshaft, or have the oem crank internally balanced with the use of slugs of "mallory metal". Balancers and flywheels designed for internally balanced motors do not have counterweights cast into them, they are themselves in a state of balance.
clear as mud? If I was home I could throw some pictures up for you, but I'm in Visalia this weekend.
your imbalanced friend on & off the DTBB, George
Hmmmmm.
quote:Originally posted by george pence:
the oem crankshaft from Ford is designed for "external" balance, hence your harmonic balancer and flywheel have counterweights cast into them, putting them in a state of imbalance, these counterweights become integral to the balance of the crankshaft. As an assembly, the crankshaft with the flywheel & balancer attached, is in a state of balance.
This is good enough for operation to 7500 rpm. Racers wanting to run the engine harder either purchase an "internally" balanced crankshaft, or have the oem crank internally balanced with the use of slugs of "mallory metal". Balancers and flywheels designed for internally balanced motors do not have counterweights cast into them, they are themselves in a state of balance.
clear as mud? If I was home I could throw some pictures up for you, but I'm in Visalia this weekend.
your imbalanced friend on & off the DTBB, George
quote:Originally posted by Coz:
Hmmmmm.
I don't know the words, but if you play the tune, I'll hum along!
George
Thanks George! You are the "answer man"!
...You can lighten your flywheel if you have access to a metal lathe. The steel would be removed equally around the entire diameter of the wheel. True, there are sure to be 'Pockets' or areas of unequal weight, but this could be balanced out as you would have the entire reciprocating assembly REbalanced AFTER the Lathe operation was done. You need to take it to a machine shop and a machinist that KNOWS what they are doing!!!I.E. work only on the perifery beyond the pressure plate, leaving everything towards the center, and balance weight, alone; champher and smooth all sharp edges. They would NOT be able to remove very much meterial(maybe 3 or 4 pounds), because you can only make it SO thin, and still be 'halfway safe'. And ANY amount you remove WILL make it THAT much WEAKER, at Higher revs!. I would do it for you except I don't have THAT large of a lathe. You need one with a 16"-17" 'Swing'. Just larger than the flywheel diameter. Drilling holes MIGHT work, if you can be ABSOLUTELY accurate!! you would need a rotary table. But for the few onces you saved; you would lose so much strength. I worked on my replacement flywheel myself;It came undrilled for the Mclowd Pressure Plate. I machined the 6 mounting holes to with-in .0005", and it spins perfectly smooth!!...