Ownership in legal terms

I bought my car in the USA, remotely from Australia. and from what I found out you need the car's title. It is a legal document, whoever has that in their hand owns the car.
So make sure the person who you are giving the $$ to has his name on the title. and make sure you or a trusted person has posession of the title.

The title is the legal document for proof of ownership. Many juristictions will also require a bill of sale before the title can formally be transferred to your name. This is supposed to be additional assurance for the title agencies that you legally obtained the title but in reality, it's so they can tax you.

Kelly

By number plate I guess you mean the license plate? In the US this can vary. The license plate (or tag, as it is sometimes referred) is associated with the car. However, some states allow you to transfer the license plate to another car on sale of the car it was originally attached.

HI. In NEW YORK we didn't have vehicle title's until 1973 so anything from 1973 up has a title,[for vehicle sale / transfer] however PRE 1973 [1972 and earlier] vehice's have a transferrable registration and are sold by filling in the rear or the vehicle registration and signing it,[over to the new owner] also a BILL OF SALE stating car information [year - make - model - mileage - and sale price] may be required. ALSO the tag's [license plate's] DO NOT stay with the car, they need to be either transferred to another vehicle OR turned back in to the D.M.V.
JOHN

Yes, most states have what is called a title for the vehicle. The other thing to look for on the title is a lien. A lien holder is someone who is owed money for a loan on the car. So a clean title is one that, of course, matches the VIN on the car, and has no lien holders (i.e. there is no outstanding loan on the car). The seller should be able to e-mail both sides of the title so you can make sure that there are no listed lien holders. If anything does not look correct, or you have further questions, please use this board to take a look at a copy of the title that is sent to you by posting it here. People on this board are very astute to these issues and can offer our two cents worth of advice.

We bought our car from Alabama, non-title issuing state for cars prior to 1974. Well to get the car titled in Michigan, we had to have a bill of sale, the cars registration from Alabama with the owners signature, also we had to take photos of the VIN to provide the state with proof of the VIN. This step could have been skipped if we could have showed the states rep the car.
Lastly we did not notice that the paperwork from Alabama had changed during the previous owners time with the car. What had happened is the registration had misprinted the VIN number and had never been caught until we were ready to title the car in our name. It was unfortunate but we had several of the old registrations and it was very easy to see what had happened, our state was easy to deal with on that aspect of the legal change of ownership.
My point is to dot your I's and cross your T's in this endeavor. Make sure there are no lein holders, and all of the numbers on all the documents match what you have been sold.
Good luck on your Pantera trip!!!
Jeff

Ok guys, thanks.
I am looking for a clean title with no lien holder and will post a scan as soon as I have closed in on my object of desire.
I do hope the license plate can come with the car, it will look nifty in Belgium. Not sure our uniformed friends would share my feelings though?

Michel

Make sure you put insurance on the car before you ship it ..so if anything happen on the way ..your covered ..dont ask how I learned this one.

Ron

I would check with motor vehicle registration or an agency that handles vehicle transfers in your country. Ask them what documents you will need to have the vehicle transferred to your ownership as they will have the final say in the process.

Dennis

my burned out brain seems to remember that e-bay or one of it's subsidiaries have an escrow service, where funds don't get released until the sale documentation is ok'ed.

i have forgotten all the details, but a google should do it.

nazgul

I used their escrow service once -- it worked very well and the transaction went without a hitch. It was not for a car, but I would assume that it would work well for a car too; if both parties can agree on the time it would take to get the car overseas once the money is in escrow -- I think that would be the only bad part. Also, I do not know if escrow.com works outside the USA? Anyway, here is the weblink:


ESCROW.COM


Also, if the license cannot come with the car, just buy one off from eBay. No one would know the wiser -- there is no connection to the license plate to the car anyway, no matter what state it would be from -- it is just a license plate, after all, that no one can trace.

Dennis,

That is easy in Belgium; o) He who pays the license plate is the owner.

What will a carfax do for me?

Michel

quote:

Originally posted by Vereeken:
Dennis,

That is easy in Belgium; o) He who pays the license plate is the owner.

What will a carfax do for me?

For an older car the CARFAX won't be very useful.

Michel

quote:

ESCROW.COM


Also, if the license cannot come with the car, just buy one off from eBay. No one would know the wiser -- there is no connection to the license plate to the car anyway, no matter what state it would be from -- it is just a license plate, after all, that no one can trace.

I look up the escrow, looks like that could work.
Which state license plate says The Sunshine State is that california or Florida?

Michel

That would be Florida.

Connecticut's license plates should say: 'The Tax Me To Death State'.

Michael

Check out eBay for Florida license plates -- yes, they are the SUNSHINE STATE. Here is a link:

eBay Sunshine State License Plate

Best of luck on your search.

quote:

Originally posted by Cyboman:
Connecticut's license plates should say: 'The Tax Me To Death State'.

Michael

Sorry already taken up by Belgium.

quote:

Originally posted by DeMopuar:
Check out eBay for Florida license plates -- yes, they are the SUNSHINE STATE. Here is a link:

eBay


Sunshine State License Plate

Easier finding a license plate; now for that dammned Pantera!

Best of luck on your search.

Michel,

I can only tell you of my experience importing a Pantera from the USA to Canada. Hopefully this will be somewhat similar for you ...

1) when you agree on the terms of the sale with the seller, you should have them scan and email you high res copies of the TITLE and the Bill of Sale. The latter you can Google or just make one up. You don't need to pay for a Bill of Sale. I used this one: Bill of Sale

2) a MINIMUM of 3 business days before the car will reach the border crossing you plan to export through, you MUST have the title document faxed to *THAT* US Customs office so they can satisfy themselves the car is not stolen or being illegally exported (against liens, owed taxes, etc.). You MUST keep proof that you did fax them, as they are hard to reach by phone and may not tell you (even if you ask) that all is OK (although I called and was told all was OK). If you choose to export via a brokerage firm, this will be handled for you.

3) At the time of export, US Customs must review, approve and STAMP the Title as OK for Export. Without this stamp, Canada will NOT allow the car entry. If possible, have access to the seller in case there are questions. MAKE SURE that the title documents have been signed by the seller (usually on the back there is a transfer section) as without that signature, you will not be allowed to export. Again, if you use a broker, this SHOULD be covered for you.

4) Make sure you keep tidy records as you will be asked to produce the Bill of Sale and PROOF OF PAYMENT AMOUNT. I was held up at the Canada-USA border while they confirmed that I paid what I claimed I paid. This could get tricky if you get an exceptionally good deal on the car you buy. Not a bad idea to have your bank statements in hand and your banker on the ready.

5) After the car is cleared for export, you be asked to pay whatever taxes that apply in Belgium. Do your homework on this one. Here in Canada, I was asked to pay the Goods and Services (GST) Tax - which I was expecting - but they also hit me with a Duty Tax of 6.1% due to the car being manufacturered in Italy. Wrong! I paid the amount, but with the help of Mark Charlton on this list (who imported his Mangusta after I brought 3528 home), I applied for a refund of the Duty I (incorrectly) paid and was sent a nice-sized cheque in the mail! Bottom line is to be prepared - and assume that you may have to educate your border patrol!

This all may sound like a daunting task, but it's really just a step-by-step process. All you REALLY need from the seller is the Bill of Sale and the Title - and, of course, the car when you can arrange for shipment. I suggest wiring the money to your seller as there is a good paper trail that can back you up at the border. Of course, you will have to gain a rapport and some trust with your seller in order to ensure you don't get ripped off. That's what this forum is all about ... make sure you use local resources to inspect the car and give you objective feedback. Take your time. It will all work out in the end.

Feel free to PM me if you have any specific questions.

Hi EA 3528,
great write up, much appreciated,
Cheers, Tim.

THere must be a universal DNA string that makes up customs agents or politicians.
Canada looks a lot like Belgium when you try to import something. Lucky for me teh Dutch are more easy going.
Importing a Pantera in Antwerp (Belgium) means 21% VAT + 10% import duty. Importing that same car in Rotterdam (Netherlands) means 6% VAT and 0% import duty. Distance between Rotterdam and Antwerp? 60km!
All hail to the European Union!
Michel

Vereeken, I looked at the black Pantera at Carolina Motorsports in Concord, NC. I PM'd you.

quote:

Originally posted by Timsteren:
Hi EA 3528,
great write up, much appreciated,
Cheers, Tim.

Not a problem, Tim. This board was very helpful to me when I was looking, buying and then importing my cat. If you're looking for a Pantera of your own, you've come to the right place!