Tried to give some new information on a Pantera today. I guess I'm a computer idiot because man I have trouble getting around in there. I couldn't even figure out how to send information after using the contact button.
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Mark,
I have never been able to navigate that site. I have signed up a couple of times, but no luck.
I have never been able to navigate that site. I have signed up a couple of times, but no luck.
I admit that the "sign-up process" was complicated (a nightmare?) but once I got in, I really think the site is super-duper (and I am not kidding)
It is really cool to be able to search on vehicle S/Ns, car color, year, etc.
The site is truly a resource.....
But I admit - it took a dedicated effort to get access....
Rocky
It is really cool to be able to search on vehicle S/Ns, car color, year, etc.
The site is truly a resource.....
But I admit - it took a dedicated effort to get access....
Rocky
In today's day and age, having the access locked until you do something is annoying so I choose to not use the site.
There is plenty of Pantera content out there on other sites like this one, like PanteraPlace, like banzairunnerpantera that I don't feel like I am missing much.
I would likely use it if it had open access like all other Pantera sites...
There is plenty of Pantera content out there on other sites like this one, like PanteraPlace, like banzairunnerpantera that I don't feel like I am missing much.
I would likely use it if it had open access like all other Pantera sites...
all you have to do to gain access is send a photo of your car. this an amazing resource,1000's of photos , take the time to wander around the site! an email to chuck melton : editor1@provamo.com he is very helpful and responds quickly to help inquiries.
It is a great site with huge amount of listed De Tomasos. And the amount of trouble needed to get the access is quite reasonable. The requirement for also giving something is only a handy tool for gathering more and more information and it that way it surves everybody.
While I too often struggle with navigating the site, I have admiration and respect for the effort and dedication Chuck has invested into the site over the years. What it offers is unique and unavailable elsewhere. This has become a DeTomaso treasure. When restoring my GT5, the ability to look at photos of most others in existence for insight was awesome.
Serving as POCA Prez for many years, I've seen well intentioned people in the Pantera Community start valuable initiatives only to burn out or move on as the passion subsides. Often the volunteers give up because of criticism, from others not lifting a finger, and the volunteer, who is only in it to benefit others, says why bother if this is my reward.
Chuck has been indefatigable with this project, funded it himself, and stuck with it. While we are all wired a little differently in how we create solutions, I am glad that Chuck thinks differently. Fact is that if he was like most, he would have said screw it a long time ago.
Serving as POCA Prez for many years, I've seen well intentioned people in the Pantera Community start valuable initiatives only to burn out or move on as the passion subsides. Often the volunteers give up because of criticism, from others not lifting a finger, and the volunteer, who is only in it to benefit others, says why bother if this is my reward.
Chuck has been indefatigable with this project, funded it himself, and stuck with it. While we are all wired a little differently in how we create solutions, I am glad that Chuck thinks differently. Fact is that if he was like most, he would have said screw it a long time ago.
Sorry you feel that way.
At least you can feel better that the data is NOT everywhere, only dedicated DeTomaso enthusiasts have access to it.
Additionally, it is part of a library of information that documents the history of our Marque.
I think of it as a private club, like the Boy Scouts. It's Chuck's clubhouse, he gets to make the rules (unfortunately, the Boy Scouts bent to outside pressure, and I don't think they are better for changing).
Rocky
At least you can feel better that the data is NOT everywhere, only dedicated DeTomaso enthusiasts have access to it.
Additionally, it is part of a library of information that documents the history of our Marque.
I think of it as a private club, like the Boy Scouts. It's Chuck's clubhouse, he gets to make the rules (unfortunately, the Boy Scouts bent to outside pressure, and I don't think they are better for changing).
Rocky
I think that John (JT) (and Rocky) have made some very good points. Chuck has put an enormous effort into creating a resource that is freely available to access for the low (zero, really) cost of making a contribution to it. That seems extremely fair to me. I can't count the number of times I have checked his registry for details about a specific car, or to educate myself about details and differences. It is a valuable De Tomaso community resource, the cost of which — in both time and money — is covered 98% by Chuck and 2% but the rest of us who are contributing willingly.
I have been a member and/or director of many associations and running them is largely a thankless job where a handful of people take on a huge amount of work and get slagged about their efforts much of the time by some ungrateful members. George Pence hosts this forum for all of our benefit — and at no cost to any of us (and THANKS AGAIN George!). POCA has a small group of incredibly dedicated people (Jack & Judy DeRyke, Judy McCartney, Mike Drew and many others) who produce a newsletter, magazine and an annual event for the benefit of many (including me) who pay a small fee that barely covers real costs.
I understand Jake's concern about publicly posted information from these forums being included on another site without permission and I hope that can be resolved without it becoming a huge issue. Another excellent registry resource was closed down by the host for exactly these reasons (and the continued hassles of operating it and trying to keep it current when people do not volunteer details and photos). If you don't want something to be public then it should never be put on the web in the first place. Chuck is making no financial profit from it, and to me that is a key factor to remember.
Ultimately I believe that the De Tomaso community (and thus most of us) is better served when these resources exist. Future buyers can find out more about the history of a particular car (for better or worse) and protect themselves. Current owners can document the history of their car which can be a huge benefit if they ever need to sell it.
Mark
I have been a member and/or director of many associations and running them is largely a thankless job where a handful of people take on a huge amount of work and get slagged about their efforts much of the time by some ungrateful members. George Pence hosts this forum for all of our benefit — and at no cost to any of us (and THANKS AGAIN George!). POCA has a small group of incredibly dedicated people (Jack & Judy DeRyke, Judy McCartney, Mike Drew and many others) who produce a newsletter, magazine and an annual event for the benefit of many (including me) who pay a small fee that barely covers real costs.
I understand Jake's concern about publicly posted information from these forums being included on another site without permission and I hope that can be resolved without it becoming a huge issue. Another excellent registry resource was closed down by the host for exactly these reasons (and the continued hassles of operating it and trying to keep it current when people do not volunteer details and photos). If you don't want something to be public then it should never be put on the web in the first place. Chuck is making no financial profit from it, and to me that is a key factor to remember.
Ultimately I believe that the De Tomaso community (and thus most of us) is better served when these resources exist. Future buyers can find out more about the history of a particular car (for better or worse) and protect themselves. Current owners can document the history of their car which can be a huge benefit if they ever need to sell it.
Mark
I also back up the Provamo registry 100%, I think it is an absolutely fantastic resource with an incredible percentage of the total amount of De Tomasos in there, and for some model variants it is close to 100% coverage! The day that happens should be celebrated as a great milestone. I suspect that this is due in no small part to the requirement for access being dependant on finding a car not yet in the registry. This is pretty easy and Chuck is often very helpful in announcing cars not in the registry that folk can use to fulfill this requirement. I too have lost count of the times I have looked in the registry, in fact, I am a bit of an addict and almost every day I look at the latest registrations/updates that pop up each time you log in, just to see the incredible variety of original and aftermarket variations that pop up. It really is fascinating.
Chuck should be really congratulated on the amazing effort he has put into this registry and the fact that he has seen it through so it has developed into what it is today. I really fear the day he decides enough is enough and has to try and find someone (some people) to take it over. I really doubt folk (me included) realise the enormous amount of resources dedicated to keeping it up to date. It really is a living community treasure of great value to us all.
Cheers, Tim.
Chuck should be really congratulated on the amazing effort he has put into this registry and the fact that he has seen it through so it has developed into what it is today. I really fear the day he decides enough is enough and has to try and find someone (some people) to take it over. I really doubt folk (me included) realise the enormous amount of resources dedicated to keeping it up to date. It really is a living community treasure of great value to us all.
Cheers, Tim.
I don't disagree with the dedication or the value that Chuck has put into the site.
My only complaint is the that it isn't open to everybody.
Maybe I don't have a Pantera to contribute a photo of. How do I get access. Having a members only site with this stupid requirement make me stay away.
I would rather offer a monetary contribution then the stupid requirement to offer something.
I understand that this was a clever way of getting more data but maybe I don't want my cars data out there for my own personal reasons.
Maybe he could offer TWO ways to get in. ONE, the current requirement to offer a picture or something Pantera related. TWO, for those that don't want to or don't have something to offer, a small donation to the site.
Or, have it open to everybody like Panteraplace. I would argue that Mike is just as dedicated to the Pantera world but his site doesn't have any stupid requirement to get in.
I know this is an unpopular position but it is the way I feel. This is nothing against Chuck or his dedication or the value of his data.
My only complaint is the that it isn't open to everybody.
Maybe I don't have a Pantera to contribute a photo of. How do I get access. Having a members only site with this stupid requirement make me stay away.
I would rather offer a monetary contribution then the stupid requirement to offer something.
I understand that this was a clever way of getting more data but maybe I don't want my cars data out there for my own personal reasons.
Maybe he could offer TWO ways to get in. ONE, the current requirement to offer a picture or something Pantera related. TWO, for those that don't want to or don't have something to offer, a small donation to the site.
Or, have it open to everybody like Panteraplace. I would argue that Mike is just as dedicated to the Pantera world but his site doesn't have any stupid requirement to get in.
I know this is an unpopular position but it is the way I feel. This is nothing against Chuck or his dedication or the value of his data.
This hobby and love for cars so often means using money, that it´s kind of refreshing when someone requires something else. And is there any other place where I could see so much photos about Maggiora built Panteras? I´m a happy user and I will be happily sending more photos and information, whenever I happen to find an unregistered Pantera. That won´t happen daily here, next to Russia.
I also found difficulty in accessing but once in Provamo is unique and a breath of fresh air, when I had my E-Type I of course joined the club but when posting questions or queries besides one person I would never get a reply and then I realized why, they only had 25,000 members! yes 25,000 and the info was not that informative lots of sales pitch OK for some but I much prefer the pragmatic approach of Provamo, it gets you involved and has a huge amount of very interesting information perhaps the sites criteria is not for every one but I think it's great.
So I am very grateful someone can spend so much of their time and for no payment on a subject that gives me so much pleasure.
Long live Chuck and Provamo.
So I am very grateful someone can spend so much of their time and for no payment on a subject that gives me so much pleasure.
Long live Chuck and Provamo.
I found Chuck's site difficult too, I asked him to help me get started, and he did.
I rely on Chuck's registry and Peter Havlik's registry as resources for the assistance Pantera International provides. I am deeply grateful for Chuck's effort. Thank you Mr. Melton.
My thoughts on the subject.
De Tomaso automobiles and those of us who have invested money in them NEEDED a registry, just like every other community of collector car owners. It goes hand in hand with the cars becoming a valuable commodity.
De Tomaso cars were once the red-headed step children of the Italian car market. But I have witnessed De Tomaso cars becoming collectable Italian sports cars; the public's perception of the cars is changing. They are no longer the frowned-upon hybrids they once were. The demand for De Tomaso cars has risen in recent years; they have new-found desirability and respectability. What part has Chuck's registry played in this?
Selflessly investing your time, effort, money and soul into a project meant to benefit others can be a thankless job. A person does it for the personal rewards, not for the praise of others. But it can still spoil an evening when somebody criticizes you. It can also make your evening to learn your efforts are appreciated. I know many of you can relate to that in one way or another.
Alessandro De Tomaso was an independent son-of-a-gun. His cars seem to appeal to the same type of persons. Isn't it true that De Tomaso owners can argue forever whether or not the sky is blue, and never come to agreement on the issue? We are all independent sons-of-a-gun. So OF COURSE none of us are going to agree with the way Chuck operates the registry. Its in our natures not to agree! Sometimes you just gotta stand back, look at the big picture, and laugh at yourself.
You're a great bunch of guys and gals.
I rely on Chuck's registry and Peter Havlik's registry as resources for the assistance Pantera International provides. I am deeply grateful for Chuck's effort. Thank you Mr. Melton.
My thoughts on the subject.
De Tomaso automobiles and those of us who have invested money in them NEEDED a registry, just like every other community of collector car owners. It goes hand in hand with the cars becoming a valuable commodity.
De Tomaso cars were once the red-headed step children of the Italian car market. But I have witnessed De Tomaso cars becoming collectable Italian sports cars; the public's perception of the cars is changing. They are no longer the frowned-upon hybrids they once were. The demand for De Tomaso cars has risen in recent years; they have new-found desirability and respectability. What part has Chuck's registry played in this?
Selflessly investing your time, effort, money and soul into a project meant to benefit others can be a thankless job. A person does it for the personal rewards, not for the praise of others. But it can still spoil an evening when somebody criticizes you. It can also make your evening to learn your efforts are appreciated. I know many of you can relate to that in one way or another.
Alessandro De Tomaso was an independent son-of-a-gun. His cars seem to appeal to the same type of persons. Isn't it true that De Tomaso owners can argue forever whether or not the sky is blue, and never come to agreement on the issue? We are all independent sons-of-a-gun. So OF COURSE none of us are going to agree with the way Chuck operates the registry. Its in our natures not to agree! Sometimes you just gotta stand back, look at the big picture, and laugh at yourself.
You're a great bunch of guys and gals.
I do (or did
lol..) have access. I also find the registry information to be a valued resource as mentioned by others. I also agree that Chucks dedication to building and maintaining the site is awesome, despite computer idiots like me complaining.
When building the site years ago he was allowing access for data. Now I have additional data for cars not entered by me to provide. I guess I was just frustrated in the fact I couldn't figure out a online way to submit it. Then as a last resort I went to use the contact button. Typed a message and was unable to send it do to my lack of computer knowledge. I'm use to typing a message and hitting send. This one asked all kinds of ISP information that I didn't know so I just gave up.
I do think the site is a little cluttered making it difficult to navigate for a first timer or occasional user such as myself.
lol..) have access. I also find the registry information to be a valued resource as mentioned by others. I also agree that Chucks dedication to building and maintaining the site is awesome, despite computer idiots like me complaining. When building the site years ago he was allowing access for data. Now I have additional data for cars not entered by me to provide. I guess I was just frustrated in the fact I couldn't figure out a online way to submit it. Then as a last resort I went to use the contact button. Typed a message and was unable to send it do to my lack of computer knowledge. I'm use to typing a message and hitting send. This one asked all kinds of ISP information that I didn't know so I just gave up.
I do think the site is a little cluttered making it difficult to navigate for a first timer or occasional user such as myself.
I have found the site difficult to navigate and If you own the/a car listed you should be able access the site w/out "contributing" any further...
I admit I have been quite critical of Chuck's website and access in the past, but I have to give him credit and cannot deny that his methodology has worked as he has amassed data on more Pantera's than anyone before him. That alone for a one man volunteer operation is a feat in itself.
I now often send details of cars or additional photos to him, it is surprisingly often that I come across a car that is not in the registry.
Chuck is very accommodating, if you own the car sending him some additional photos is usually all that is required to have the car associated with your login.
Julian
I now often send details of cars or additional photos to him, it is surprisingly often that I come across a car that is not in the registry.
Chuck is very accommodating, if you own the car sending him some additional photos is usually all that is required to have the car associated with your login.
Julian
First I would like to thank and applaud Chuck for all the hard work on his site! And I would like to be clear that I never intended to be critical of Chuck or the site and its value to the Pantera community. I was just saying I had a hard time getting it to work for me. Chuck has helped me before to access for my 2 past Panteras, but I always had issues getting in and out of the site. Still, Thanks again Chuck for all the work you have done.
I use Macintosh computers and find that only Firefox works for me with Provamo. Apple's Safari seems not to be able to retain the login properly.
Mark
Mark
Yes, I should have qualified my statement by first acknowledging the passion and dedication required to turn interest into action. He certainly is dedicated and accomplished, to have maintained such a data base.
I enjoy the sight. I must say it took some effort and a few weeks to get access but the sight has lots of information . well worth the effort to become a member . It did take a wile to figger out how to send in pictures and the sight is hard to navigate