Just curious if anyone knows how the vin numbers correlate to the body styles differences (pushbutton, pre-L, L)
I've been able to deduce that #1000 to #1382 (approx) are the pushbutton cars but what about the other two?
TIA
Miles
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Click on the link:
http://pantera.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/7650045562...0043404?r=2990043404
cowboy from hell
http://pantera.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/7650045562...0043404?r=2990043404
cowboy from hell
Excellent.
thanks
thanks
George
Do you know if there is a Pantera registery? I know there is one for the pushbuttons...
It would be interesting (thats sad) to know what is out there after all these years.
Miles
Do you know if there is a Pantera registery? I know there is one for the pushbuttons...
It would be interesting (thats sad) to know what is out there after all these years.
Miles
There was one official registry, put together by the esteemed historian of out marque, Bill Van Ess. But what any enthusiast who tries to put together a registry soon finds out, a majority of owners are apathetic about such an endeavor, so the registry is not as complete and informative as was hoped.
The DeTomaso factory has good documentation of the cars built after the Ford era. The cars built during the Ford era have no documentation at this time. It is uncertain if the documentation was destroyed, or if it is merely sitting in a box somewhere, long forgotten by Ford. The Ford guy in charge of the Pantera project, Ray Geddes, should know. Mr. Geddes is in retirement. Hopefully somebody will have the opportunity to ask him someday.
There are 5 bits of info needed from each Pantera to paint a picture of Pantera production: (1) the chassis number (2) the body service number (3) the build date on the door jamb (4) the original destination (5) the original model type (because some cars have been modified into Gp4 race cars, GT5 & GT5-S).
Today there are several mini-registries about. There's the push-button registry, Ben Tyer's QV500, Peter Havlik's wide body registry, Ron Hyde's registry. I understand POCA has talked about putting one together on their web site. We did a poll here on the DTIC earlier this year, I asked for a virtual show of cyber-hands, asking who was interested in putting together such a registry. Out of the 150 or so members who regularly contribute to these forums, about 1/2 dozen members wrote they were interested. Now THAT'S apathy.
Still, I am aware of a web based registry in the planning stages, the owner has sworn me to silence. Such an endeavor involves a hefty financial investment in programming and server bandwidth. He wants to protect his investment.
Many registries for other marques are put together out of necessity. For instance, in the 1980's Shelby Mustang "fakes" were rampant, parts were readily available to turn regualr 1965 Mustangs into the highly valued Shelby versions, so to prevent fraud and give buyers legal assistance, a registry was started. Whenever certain low volume models exist within the general production run of a certain model, and those low volume models have significantly more value than the run of the mill variety, and when it is easy to make the run of the mill car into a fraudulant copy of the low volume car, registries become a necessity. The fraudulant sale of DeTomaso automobiles is not a rampant problem at this time. So we don't need a registry to document the authenticity of our cars, but it would be nice to develope a more precise understanding of the production history.
cowboy from hell
The DeTomaso factory has good documentation of the cars built after the Ford era. The cars built during the Ford era have no documentation at this time. It is uncertain if the documentation was destroyed, or if it is merely sitting in a box somewhere, long forgotten by Ford. The Ford guy in charge of the Pantera project, Ray Geddes, should know. Mr. Geddes is in retirement. Hopefully somebody will have the opportunity to ask him someday.
There are 5 bits of info needed from each Pantera to paint a picture of Pantera production: (1) the chassis number (2) the body service number (3) the build date on the door jamb (4) the original destination (5) the original model type (because some cars have been modified into Gp4 race cars, GT5 & GT5-S).
Today there are several mini-registries about. There's the push-button registry, Ben Tyer's QV500, Peter Havlik's wide body registry, Ron Hyde's registry. I understand POCA has talked about putting one together on their web site. We did a poll here on the DTIC earlier this year, I asked for a virtual show of cyber-hands, asking who was interested in putting together such a registry. Out of the 150 or so members who regularly contribute to these forums, about 1/2 dozen members wrote they were interested. Now THAT'S apathy.
Still, I am aware of a web based registry in the planning stages, the owner has sworn me to silence. Such an endeavor involves a hefty financial investment in programming and server bandwidth. He wants to protect his investment.
Many registries for other marques are put together out of necessity. For instance, in the 1980's Shelby Mustang "fakes" were rampant, parts were readily available to turn regualr 1965 Mustangs into the highly valued Shelby versions, so to prevent fraud and give buyers legal assistance, a registry was started. Whenever certain low volume models exist within the general production run of a certain model, and those low volume models have significantly more value than the run of the mill variety, and when it is easy to make the run of the mill car into a fraudulant copy of the low volume car, registries become a necessity. The fraudulant sale of DeTomaso automobiles is not a rampant problem at this time. So we don't need a registry to document the authenticity of our cars, but it would be nice to develope a more precise understanding of the production history.
cowboy from hell
Miles and George,
I made several attempts to contact Rey Geddes a few years ago about my 1966 GT350. He never responded. My understanding is that Rey was the middleman between Ford and Shelby, DeTomaso, and other partners. I don't believe that he knew any particular cars or much more than the relationships between partners. I may be wrong but I never could find out anything from him.
Good luck in your search,
Bill #3382
I made several attempts to contact Rey Geddes a few years ago about my 1966 GT350. He never responded. My understanding is that Rey was the middleman between Ford and Shelby, DeTomaso, and other partners. I don't believe that he knew any particular cars or much more than the relationships between partners. I may be wrong but I never could find out anything from him.
Good luck in your search,
Bill #3382
Also...
Kevin Marti (Marti Auto Works) has all of the Ford documentation on pantera's from 1971-74. It contains all of the serial numbers, dealer info, etc. What he doesn't have or know for that matter is what all of the seriel numbers represent. For instance, he doesn't know what the number is for Red Exterior. It makes deciphering your Pantera's nearly impossible. He was able to tell me the dealer name, location, delivery date, etc... Unless owners of original cars provide him their own individual breakdowns of their cars, and he compiles this info, there is no way to ever know what these serial numbers mean.
I attempted and posted a few crys for help on this bb about a year ago and Kevin was willing to help us with the codes --- only 2 people responded.
Hope this helps...
Bill - x3382
Kevin Marti (Marti Auto Works) has all of the Ford documentation on pantera's from 1971-74. It contains all of the serial numbers, dealer info, etc. What he doesn't have or know for that matter is what all of the seriel numbers represent. For instance, he doesn't know what the number is for Red Exterior. It makes deciphering your Pantera's nearly impossible. He was able to tell me the dealer name, location, delivery date, etc... Unless owners of original cars provide him their own individual breakdowns of their cars, and he compiles this info, there is no way to ever know what these serial numbers mean.
I attempted and posted a few crys for help on this bb about a year ago and Kevin was willing to help us with the codes --- only 2 people responded.
Hope this helps...
Bill - x3382
Kevin is a good guy. Years ago the cougar community got interested in the info. Now, everytime you see a nice one for sale, you see the "marti report" listed, As cougar values go up, it is an important thing.
Due to the level of mods on Panteras, I don't see it meaning as much. It would be nice for historical reference.
Due to the level of mods on Panteras, I don't see it meaning as much. It would be nice for historical reference.
quote:Originally posted by Plankton:
...What he doesn't have or know for that matter is what all of the seriel numbers represent. For instance, he doesn't know what the number is for Red Exterior...
What Mr Marti has is the domestic destination info, he doesn't have the build info from Modena. He can tell you that a Pantera with VIN number XXX was delivered to XXX dealership.
Mr. Marti isn't in tune with the DeTomaso scene, and he isn't approaching anybody for a tune up. All he need do is contact PI or POCA, we are contacted daily for information by people and organizations from around the world.
The VIN code, aka the chassis number, doesn't provide the detailed info Mr Marti expects. It tells you its a Pantera, made by DeTomaso in Modena, Vignale's build date of the coach (NOT the final assembly date of the vehicle), and the sequential build number for the coach (NOT the sequence for the final assembly). That's all the info contained in the VIN number.
The body service number, fastened to the foot box in the front trunk, tells you the cars final sequential assembly order. The earliest Panteras do not have that tag, Ford adopted its use in 1972. The build date in the door jamb is the cars final assembly date, and can be one month older than the date built into the VIN number. That's why you need all 3 numbers to construct a production history. The VIN number is next to worthless. Options, paint color, information like that, is not incorporated into any of the numbers.
cowboy from hell
A lot of the info Kevin provides to others isn't relavent to us. Things like options, etc. When being judged, they need to know what came from the factory on that car. People also tend to overuse his info by saying that their car is "1 of 1 car with power windows, 6spd and microwave oven". Doesn't matter for us.
And George, maybe this explains to me why I don't seem to have a plaque where the brake master is since mine is a 71? Of course, it could have been lost.
And George, maybe this explains to me why I don't seem to have a plaque where the brake master is since mine is a 71? Of course, it could have been lost.
Since we are on the subject of registry's and vin's I might as well chime in. While admittedly small in comparison to the "official" registry, it is most current and not 10 years out of date. Those of you with microsoft excel can view, download, and submit data on your particular car. Why did I choose the Excel format? Well, once I get enough individual registration forms returned, I can then add charts, graphs, and stats sheets. How many of what style bumper came on 72's, the number of a/c vents, etc. The bar graphs would then show when a particular feature first appeared, peaked, then ended. Obviously some of these different features started and stopped at different times, that's what makes each Pantera different. I have toyed with the idea of adding an owner submitted photo to the respective sheet, but the file begins to get LARGE to the point that dial up download could be an issue. So if you feel the need, you can submit your info by downloading the form from my web page and e-mailing it back to me. All I ask is that you make it complete as possible, and yes, it's free.