Full Roll Cage -- Hidden

I doubt anyone has taken on a project like this. The trim pieces are so small on these cars you would not fit anything behind them. A tight fitting exposed cage would probably be less intrusive than trying to make custom panels to fit over the tubing plus the larger tubing would be stronger as well. Just my opinion. Good luck with the project if you take it on. Keep us posted and keep the pics flowing. Its always cool to see people doing new things.

Blaine

Steve Wilkinson installed a hidden roll bar (I don't think it was a full cage) in a customer's Pantera last year. He also put a Ford GT engine & transaxle in the same car. I expect this would have been a "cost is no object" project.

Peter,
The car you are talking about is my car. I was just wondering if anyone else has tried to do such a thing? Sounds like this idea has not been tried, at least not in great numbers. Thanks, Mark

Mark:

Your car is the only one I am aware of (although that does not mean it hasn't been done before). I have seen some photos of your roll bar installation underway; very impressive. You are going to have an incredible machine when the project is done!

How did you get your hands on that Ford GT engine and transaxle?

Demoupar ...how about a few pics of your hidden roll cage ?

Ron

Yes, I saw the car being worked on at Steve's too, Never got to see it with the motor mounted, It was a very nice car to start with .. Pic's please...

Peter H,

I purchased the Ford GT motor and Ricardo 6 speed transaxle from an outfit in Michigan. They then drop shipped both of these units directly to Steve in Paramount. The reason I went with the Ricardo 6 speed is because of the ease of shifting and the light feel of the clutch -- while still having enough holding power. This thing will shift like butter and still be able to handle the power. I looked into purchasing the RBT 6 speed transaxle, but the cost of the Ricardo was not much more; and the technology and ease of use really trumped RBT's unit, IMHO. The bad part of the Ricardo is the size, not length wise so much as the width. It required Steve to start over in the rear of the car; but man did these guys really shine with a great solution. They did cut the wheelhouse quite a bit at the rear of the engine (being a dry sump engine; it could be dropped down quite a bit over the wet sump cousins). The attachment for the upper control arm was pushed away from the center of the car; and so was the lower control arm. As this was becoming a Group 4 flared car anyway, Steve was able to play with the offset of the custom rims to make everything work together. They also custom manufactured the rear frame of the car. They built this out of rectangular steel rather than built up sheet metal. This would probably be best for a car with a minimum of 550 HP anyway. It was a very elegant solution to a complex problem.

I'll see if I can send a few photos from work on what has been done so far as far as the roll cage. It is not meant for track days though, I know it would be laughed out of the inspection area. The reason it is being done is because of the power of the 5.4L GT motor and what that would do to the body if no structure was installed (i.e. cracking and twisted metal badness). The car has not been run as of yet, but if it runs as good as I am hoping; then sometime in the future I would love to look at installing a Whipple supercharger on this thing. I wanted to install as much structure as possible for any future power increase -- I'll just have to see how this all pans out because I really do not know what I am talking about right now anyway.

I just have to say that the people on this board are the best. From reading old posts for a while this is not really a new concept, but it is true.

Mark

Thanks for the interesting information, Mark. It sounds like your cat will be a real credit to the breed. Amazing stuff.

Wow! I saw that car at Steve's. I loved the hidden roll bar and super solid chassis. Pretty sick drivetrain too. What stage is it at now? Yes, pics please!

Rear frame of car; rectangular structural steel custom made for Ford GT 5.4L motor and Ricardo 6 speed.

Mark

Engine Compartment with the engine installed. Dry sump engine with custom frame hooked into existing monocoque with lowered floor pans.

Mark

Lower portion of the installed engine on the new fabricated frame. Notice the dry sump of the engine and how low it can go in the frame -- great for handling and fitting under the engine cover. Also, notice the rusty heater matrix pipes -- am going to replace this with either stainless or Aeroquip.

Mark

Passenger's side almost hidden roll bar. The vertical portion near the door is not going to be hidden.

Mark

Photo taken from Driver's side looking to Passenger's side showing hidden, almost, roll bar.

Mark

Passenger side engine compartment. Second fuel tank was installed to facilitate getting across Nevada without running out of fuel. Fuel tanks will be hooked together and share a common Ford GT variable speed fuel pump.

Mark

Very Cool! I also saw the car at Steve's last time I was there. A very big project.

Thats awesome! I hope I get a chance to see that one in person. Keep up the good work!

Blaine

Ah ...comprende the roll bar now ? Very nice job. Is the bulkhead moved foward for clearance fo the motor ?

Good Luck ...is it completed or are these pics of the actual stage its in at this moment.

ROn

Ron,

The last photos is the stage of the car right now. The firewall is in the same place as it was; just completely redone to include a larger access and stronger pipes. You will also notice vertical rectangular steel supports built into the firewall. Steve Wilkinson is working on getting the car plumbed for fuel lines, engine cooling lines, and intercooler lines so the engine can be hooked up and ran for the first time in the car. This will hopefully happen the next month or so.

The last photo is an interesting one too (with the fuel tank). You can see the depth of the sinking of the engine into the wheel house ahead of the spreader bar. Pretty extreme surgery; but it is turning out better than I expected.

The front of the motor of the Ford GT is shorter than the 351 motors; so the engine fits nicely with the exception of the wheel houses. This 5.4L dry sump engine can really be sunk down into the car -- a huge advantage for handling; even though it will be a Gran Turismo and not a track car.

Mark