Is there no one else!?

Numbers?

We don't need no stinkin numbers!!!

I guess if there was a strip near home, I'd go and see what I could do. But there isn't, so I haven't. And if I had the spare change for a suction cup mounted toy that would give me some numbers, maybe I'd buy one. I did dyno the car at Vegas in '03 and got 297 RWHP.

But really, I don't care. I'm not braggin about my Pantera. I'm not racing for pink slips. I'm sure there are Vipers, Camaros and rice rockets in town that can out perform 2511.

But the bottom line is this:

There are a lot of nice cars out there on the roads today, but they are not a Pantera - the most beautiful, mid engined car ever conceived. It is powered by a bad ass Ford pushrod V-8, it SOUNDS bad ass, it is not a cookie cutter car that any neighbor can go and buy at the dealer, and owning it has fulfilled a thirty year old dream.

And I'm driving it ..... the other guy is wishing he could ;-)

Larry

Larry,

thanks....the thought was expressed perfectly

George

I agree with you Larry 100%! With countless porsches and vipers that are on every street corner they have nothing else to discuss but numbers. As a PANTERA owner and lover we don't need calculators and accountants we simply admire what we have and watch others drool.

I'm running over 500 HP, The car hauls ass,,, "When I jump on it". I would not take my car to the drag strip. I like my ZF trans to much, I'm sure it could take it ,,,But,,, we will not be speed shifting this polished ZF any time soon.

Well, it has been a few years but I did have mine on the strip in Sacramento. Lots of wheel spin 118 mph and 12.75. Haven't had the new engine on a chassis dyno or strip yet.

I was at the strip a few weeks ago. It was very hot, low 90s high 80s but the car was in the very high 12s at the end of the night trapping at 109 or so. The cooler temp was, the faster the times. My car will be in the high 1:20s at Blackhawk Farms and I've forgotten my exact Road America times but I will check. They were something under 3:00 I believe. I also have times for Autobahn CC, north and south. It's written down in the car. Those times are on Michelin Pilots. Smoke em if you got em. A hotted up Pantera should be competitve with a stock C 5 at the strip and on a road course. Past a certain point, it doesn't matter anymore. For a 30 something year old car, They're great! Does that sound like Tony the Tiger there? If they gave points for cool, a Pantera always wins.

Well, I understand that the cars are rare and no one needs to prove themselves in the sports car community, but I have owned three Porsche's and two Vette's in the past and I drive them.

I know all the times of these cars and soon will on my Pantera as well. I hope to see 600 horsepower when finished. I will post the times on the list for reference to anyone who is interested.

These are beautiful cars, but I did not buy a wall painting. The car will have to be able to perform or I will not keep it long.
Steve

Steve, I think you have found there is a strong emotional attachment among most Pantera owners for their cars.

You are welcome to have as little or as much attachment as you feel proper.

Don't forget, the Pantera is a 30+ year old Classic Italian sports car. NO other 30 year old sports car is expected by the owners to be competitive with the 2005 models. NONE.

But, the Pantera can acquit itself reasonably well, say in comparison to a modern Corvette, which would have cost you about the same amount of money. The 351C can be tuned to make a competitive 400 bhp easily.

This morning, as I drove to work, I stopped to buy donuts for my employees, a guy & his wife were outside checking out the car. A kid on a bicycle yelled out, nice car mister! A group of 3 ladies at Starbucks stopped me and inquired about the car. A couple of guys at the gas station checked it out as I fueled it this morning, there eyes followed me as I pulled out of the service station and headed down the highway. As I drove to work, nobody passed me, everybody slowed down & followed so they can check out the car. This is all in one morning's drive to work. That will never happen with a 'Vette or Porsche. People in general, not just Pantera owners, admire our cars. Power, sex & beauty on wheels. I was just thinking as I drove this morning, man did Tom Tjaarda hit the nail square on the head.

your friend on the PIBB, George

quote:

People in general, not just Pantera owners, admire our cars. Power, sex & beauty on wheels. I was just thinking as I drove this morning, man did Tom Tjaarda hit the nail square on the head.

Couldn't agree more

This might be one of those times when everyone is right. The car be be many things to different people. That's why we're all here.

Ok, here are some numbers. I have been building my car for 6 years. I have driven it 0 times. Hopefully it will have >1 hp. I plan to go through 1/4 inch of tire in two months and stop every 10 miles for gas. Hope those numbers make you feel better.

I was driving last weekend, getting miles put on the new motor so I can change out the break in oil. A guy in a brand new vette with a drop dead gorgeous blonde in the front seat pulls along side. He keeps reving his engine and jerking the car forward, trying to get me to race him. I looked over at the blonde. She wasn't saying anything but the look on her face practically screamed "rescue me from this jerk". So as far as performance numbers, I would say it is a 8.5 in the babe magnet department.

DeTom, the Pantera is at least 8.5 on the babe magnet scale, maybe a perfect 10.0

While the guys can't take their eyes off the car, their lady friends always make the coy glance to check out the owner as well. If I have a female companion on board, she gets the envious inspection too. (Have you ever noticed the difference in the facial expression when a lady checks you out as compared to when she checks your lady passenger out?)

You see, the non-owners think the car is more expensive than it is. They're thinking mega-buck new Ferrari kind of money. So the gals are thinking, boy would I like to have his bank account to deplete! LOL

I've had many older ladies tell me, I don't know what that car is, but it smells like MONEY! LOL. I just put my hand on my back pocket, covering my wallet & back away. LOL

The Corvette driver made a serious error in judgement. Never race your car with a lady on board. Unless she is the unique lady who likes that sort of thing. Hopefully he'll learn from his mistake.

Mark, that was a good comeback for a drag race challenge, I'll have to keep that in the senior memory bank.

your friend on the PIBB, getting ready to head for Starbucks, George

Absolutely right. THe car has the big money look to it. Even a mechanic who I had instal my new engine assumed he was working on a car that cost a few hundred grand. It came back all polished up and spotless. You are right, women see the car and right away start fantasing how they will spend your money.

My wife drove the car from our old house out to our property. Heading down the main drag in town in the couse of about 3 miles she had 3 guys pull up next to her and start talking to her. I was following in a pickup truck. One guy at a light next to me hollered at me, "hey, you see that chick in that car!"

I am glad I love and trust my wife! We still laugh about it. Funny thing is some og the gawkers were in more expensive cars! Yea, it's fun! And it's equally fun when your on a back road all by yourself!

Gary

Yeah Gary. I don't have to be going fast or anything to just enjoy the car. I live in the mountains and cruising the backroads thi Sunday was a spiritual experiance. It was beutiful.

Exactly. There are a few who are extremely critical of others if not downright aerogent if we don't enter our cars in 150-200mph open road rallys. It's my damn car and I'll enjoy it how I wish right! I drove by a couple kids and they were rotating their fingers for me to do a burn out. I smiled, I burn rubber ($$$) for my benifit, not theirs!

Gary

quote:

Originally posted by DeTom:
Yeah Gary. I don't have to be going fast or anything to just enjoy the car. I live in the mountains and cruising the backroads thi Sunday was a spiritual experiance. It was beutiful.

Gary,

I have a "burning rubber" story for you. One of my employees, a fellow named Bob, was observed burning rubber while exiting a parking lot, by a member of the county sheriff's department. Bob was driving a Thunderbird Super Coupe.

Bob is a fellow my age who grew up in the '60s, didn't think burning rubber was a big deal. The younger deputy was livid due to Bob's blatant disrespect for public safety, he had to be restrained by fellow deputies who arrived on the scene minutes later, as he was on the verge of becoming physically violent. Bob was charged with felonious exhibition of speed.

Bob hired a lawyer for $1500 and was able to have the charge dimissed on a technicality, due to the fact the violation occured in a parking lot & not on a public street. The parking lot signs were not properly posted. Had Bob been a few more feet out into the public roadway, or had the signs in the parking lot been properly posted, and Bob would have had a felony conviction on his record for the rest of his life.

The arrest ocurrd in about 1991, in southern California, once the hot rod capitol of the world. Its a different world we live in.

As a side note, do not be too quick to judge the ardent open road racer, as I know him to be a decent gentleman, like most Pantera owners.

Its sometimes difficult to know when someone is speaking with tongue in cheek. I hope nobody believes I'm really as naive as Yorgay!! LOL Heck, I'm not even Czechoslovakian, I'm half Okie! LOL

your friend on the PIBB, George

quote:

Originally posted by george pence:

As a side note, do not be too quick to judge the ardent open road racer, as I know him to be a decent gentleman, like most Pantera owners.

Roger on that.

good story. My brothers and I were together with my parents not too long ago. We all have to age before we hear the good stories. He was talking about when he and another guy was racing in high school. This was back in the mid 50's. I think they were racing model A's and they were nothing special; mostly just seeing what they would run. He talked how his friend over took him but with the aerodynamic drag blocked by his budys car he was able to reverse his luck and pass his budy....All while going down a populer road at night with many other cars on it at the time....

You see, at the time the cars they were racing were so old, the daily drivers were passing them as they "raced"!

It's not just golddigging women who love the Pantera. Kids go ape over it. THey act like they have just seen the Batmobile. Of course it does kind of look like the Batmobile, don't ya think???

Funny you should write that,

whenever I pull up to my driveway & use the remote to open the garage door, I always think to myself I'm entering the bat cave. LOL

George

This is one cool thread - full of wonderful experiences and heartwarming explanations about why we love these cars. Plus I learned that if I confine my illegal antics to parking lots I can avoid being arrested.

And that "...race you to Atlantic City" is a great one! Have a look at this email I just received from a "friend of a friend" with the subject heading that reads:

Mercedes, Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, Viper, Corvette and especially Pantera KILLER!!!!!!!! 

Twin turbo rice rocket at about 3,000 lbs. Now what do I do?

Well,

just park next to him & see which one gets all the attention, especially from the ladies.

Seriously, the front engine, fwd layout of the "sport compacts", the narrow chassis, etc hinders them from being the killers the owners would like to think they are, but I don't want to sound as if I'm scoffing at the sport compacts or their owners at all. The kids are pushing their cars to the limit, turning the little economy cars into very fast performers, considering where they are starting from. The best sport compacts have some very fine craftsmanship put into them, the owners are justifiably proud of their creations. And on a certain very tight twisty road could give you a problem. Overall though, the sport compact chassis wasn't built for high speeds, or to handle seriously high amounts of bhp.

So pick a road and the race is on.

George

While I admire the work done ont hose ricers, I can't stop laughing at them. I could care less how fast they go, it spoils the fun. They can blow away a rail car and I would still distance myself from them.

I took my car to the dyno a while back. The owner said "I love to hear the real cars run. I am getting so tired of hearing these ricers. They sound like ANGRY SEWING MACHINES....And I own one!"

gandalfthegray aren't you the one that bought the white gt5 clone off Ebay ?

And PanteraTurbo aren't you the one that has the site on Car Domain ? haven't seen any updates in a while. Always like the widebody Pantera's.

comp2, not sure why so much hate. My neighbor has a 600 RWHP twin-turbo Supra that will destroy anything on the street. It is one wicked car.

But as much as I like the car, I have more admiration for the owner since I've witnessed all the work he's personally done to the car to bring it to this stage. Incredible..in my book.

Josh

Josh it's not hate, I just find them hilarious. Just chock it up to "I don't get it". To me it may as well be a shopping cart with fuzzy dice, a gold plated crown on the dash and 600hp chevy 350. No offense.

Gary

Gary-

Too bad you "don't get" 600 RWHP.

Me? I'm addicted to horsepower!!!

No offense taken.

Josh

Josh I am just hard to please. I don't even like 90% of the cars in Hot Rod anymore. I think I could like a psycadlic monstrocity from the 60's so I am not completely in line either. I always remember the toons of the monsters hanging out of the dragsters and such from the 70's. I think what you do from about 10yrs to about 20 years "imprints" in you. I look back and my Dad collects cars that he liked when he was 10-20. He runs a 1902 olds and a 1903 olds a couple hundred miles a year. He has been working on them since he was 12-14. He has some cars from his high school years I am not atracted to at all, crow vic, etc. Neat old cars, I just don't like them like his T's, his A and his 50's Chevys; although I do have a real atatchment for his Edsil. I think that is due to it's sheer size. I could replace my Ford F-350 with that thing!

Gary

quote:

Originally posted by pantera someday:
gandalfthegray aren't you the one that bought the white gt5 clone off Ebay ?

And PanteraTurbo aren't you the one that has the site on Car Domain ? haven't seen any updates in a while. Always like the widebody Pantera's.

You betcha buddy! I'll try to get some updates up there soon. Oh so close!! Meanwhile I will just keep on reading these stories for inspiration.

Yes, to answer Panterasomedays question, I did purchase the GT-5 Clone.

This has got to be one of the best looking cars ever built. However, I new based on the "hot potato" history of the cars sales/owners in the past year I was probably in for a bit of a surprise. I brought the car into one of the local southern California Pantera shops for an inspection.

The first of a long list of problems was quickly realised as I opened the front hood. They pointed out the fact that I had no brake booster! This was the obvious reason the car had poor brakes. The second problem is that the brake master is rigged from some GM car and has to be completley replaced for the rough guess of around a grand. Ouch. At least the calipers are JFZ which I was told were a decent caliper. Any thoughts on this?

Second, the vibration that I had asked about earlier, is due to the worn halfshafts from the trans. These sell for the pair at $700. Not including the labor. Ouch.

Third, the trans grinds in the first to second gear shift and also in reverse. They assured me of worn synchros. And spoke of $2500 to $3500 for repair. Remember the add stated "trans rebuilt in 2003"

Fourth, includes the engine. The Nascar aluminum engine turned out to just be a painted iron block. And not SVO either. The heads however are the SVO C-302. I believe these to be good heads. Any thoughts on this? Does anyone know any actual specs on these heads? George? The carburetor is completley shot. The fuel pressure regulator is plumbed wrong and is in line on the return line, after the fuel has already passed thru the carb. (at 9 1/2 lbs). The secondaries are completly shut off and only oone jet is open part of a turn. The shop was amazed that the car even ran. The fix? A new Demon carb for around $650. "ouch"

Fifth, is the steering rack that I had asked about before.

In the wake of this news, I have not given up. I am determined to save this otherwise beautiful automotive acheivment. I like what it stands for and it holds great posibilities. And it will run in the elevens, I promise.

GM brake master anyone?......cheap!

Steve

Steve,

Yeah, the C302 heads are excellent heads & the iron block explains the 373 cubes we wondered about a while back. If the engine is in good shape, you have the parts to make substantial bhp. 500 to 600 bhp. We can talk about it later as you get things sorted & are ready to dive into the motor. My suggestion, get it running reliable, working right & enjoy your new car a while as is, give your self time to think about priorities.

The second gear syncro is usually the first to go, but it may not be "gone". It may be a linkage adjustment, a clutch release problem, or a combination or the two. You also need time to get used to the tranny. For reverse, push in the clutch, count to 5, then make the shift to reverse. You'll see.

You might find a brake booster at the TPOC swap meet at the end of this month in Anaheim.

your friend on the PIBB, George

Wow. Now we got our American blood boiling! I think the different appreciation is purely age. Us old farts remain addicted to Detroit Iron - there's no replacement for displacement - and the young dudes love to get a thousand horsepower from a lawnmover with 22 inch wheels. That'a all it is - old vs young.

Ya know what? The ricer that says he can KILL ME probably would. He must have 700+ HP in that monster. As much as I would love to race him, George, the "5 minute" throw from 1st to second will likely kill me, and I don't think it's worth blowing up my ZF powershifting just to try and stay with him. Do I have anything to gain racing a Nissan? No. If I win, folks will say "so what, against a Nissan?" If I lose I will be impressed with his handiwork, but embarrassed just the same.

But if he wants to keep on chuggin' (like, to Atlantic City) I figure I'll fly by him about 18 seconds after the start - too late to claim victory, however. And he'll probably lift long before, especially when his over revving, rapidly drying sewing machine is drowned out by the thunder of me tearing by his rice paddy ass.

David,

I didn't know it was a drag race. Getting 700 bhp to the ground without wheel spin is HIS problem. And without snapping the CV shafts, twisting the frame, and on, and on. How long can his transaxle hold up to 700 bhp? Gosh, 700 bhp. He must be running 37 psi of boost.

Ever driven a big block classic Mustang? Lots of power. You can burn rubber in all 4 gears, still be burning rubber at 90 to 100 mph in 4th. Fun as hell, but not the way to accelerate quickly, which was why, until the 320 bhp Cobra Mustang was introduced, the '71 Boss 351 was the fastest Mustang off the showroom floor. The 351 didn't overwhelm the chassis as much as the big blocks.

Your problem is easy to fix, start in second gear. Try it some time.

Your assessment is right, not much to win, much more to lose. I was writing tongue in cheek anyway when I said pick a road & the race is on. Tongue in cheek? Or would it be more accurate to write keyboard in cheek?

Always a good time hanging with you guys on the PIBB, George

gandalfthegray I know the guy that sold the gt5 clone to the guy you bought it from had another Pantera for sale,so I am thinking he finds them and resales them to make a profit,and the guy you bought it from probably found this stuff out when he bought it thats why he sold it soon after he got it.

But I am glad you are sticking with it cause it was a nice car,so don't forget to add some photos of your car to let everybody see it.

George, it must be the Eau de Pantera that you are wearing!

quote:

Originally posted by george pence:
DeTom, the Pantera is at least 8.5 on the babe magnet scale, maybe a perfect 10.0

While the guys can't take their eyes off the car, their lady friends always make the coy glance to check out the owner as well. If I have a female companion on board, she gets the envious inspection too. (Have you ever noticed the difference in the facial expression when a lady checks you out as compared to when she checks your lady passenger out?)

You see, the non-owners think the car is more expensive than it is. They're thinking mega-buck new Ferrari kind of money. So the gals are thinking, boy would I like to have his bank account to deplete! LOL

I've had many older ladies tell me, I don't know what that car is, but it smells like MONEY! LOL. I just put my hand on my back pocket, covering my wallet & back away. LOL

The Corvette driver made a serious error in judgement. Never race your car with a lady on board. Unless she is the unique lady who likes that sort of thing. Hopefully he'll learn from his mistake.

Mark, that was a good comeback for a drag race challenge, I'll have to keep that in the senior memory bank.

your friend on the PIBB, getting ready to head for Starbucks, George

quote:

Originally posted by george pence:
Steve,

Yeah, the C302 heads are excellent heads & the iron block explains the 373 cubes we wondered about a while back. If the engine is in good shape, you have the parts to make substantial bhp. 500 to 600 bhp. We can talk about it later as you get things sorted & are ready to dive into the motor. My suggestion, get it running reliable, working right & enjoy your new car a while as is, give your self time to think about priorities.

The second gear syncro is usually the first to go, but it may not be "gone". It may be a linkage adjustment, a clutch release problem, or a combination or the two. You also need time to get used to the tranny. For reverse, push in the clutch, count to 5, then make the shift to reverse. You'll see.

You might find a brake booster at the TPOC swap meet at the end of this month in Anaheim.

your friend on the PIBB, George

Gary Hall had his simularly equiped "Big Red" running in the tens back in the early 1990s. I am sure if someone is willing to make enough mods that a Pantera can be a nine or even eight second car. How quick do you want to go?? How much do you want to spend?? Heck you go far enough and you just wind up with a pantera replica fiberglass funny car.

quote:

Originally posted by george pence:
How much do you want to spend?? Heck you go far enough and you just wind up with a pantera replica fiberglass funny car.

Wasn't there one down in australia as featured in the PI Magazine or POCA profiles?

Jeff
6559

I don't know. I don't have a membership.