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So I don't divert the engine bay hole thread I started a new one.

One of the things I was working on, a work in progress is new a-arms. I wanted control over a few things. The first step was to build a jig. The jig has markings and is adjustable. The stock piece is put in, then you can make changes to the location of the ball joints then use build a new a-arm to speck on the jig.



These are from laser parts I could sell. I have been looking at maybe selling a few Pantera laser cut parts but I am reluctant as there is not enough volume to make it worth my time. Anything I make will pretty much be available and even charging for it I will never sell enough to recoup the cost but that's ok.

If you are not familiar with the laser this is what it does. Think of it as a 30,000lb HP printer that cuts metal:

http://www.wadecnc.com/photos/dsc_0410.avi

The laser will cut up to 1/2" steel but we are bringing on line a Plasma which will cut anything we can put under the gantry which means a foot thick or more:



ANYWAY.....after messing with making a tubular frame I did not like it. The original design is quite neat in that it makes a very light and strong a-arm even to the point the aluminum a-arms can not be built as light.

Ironic as some one building aluminum a-arms had ripped me up for copying his design when he didn't even know what I was doing.

I did not like the tubular I built so I visited the idea of building them similar to the originals. After doing one set I think I very much like the direction.











The original had caster adjustment but nothing noteworthy; more of an adjustment for suspension tuning; such as if your car constantly goes left, etc.

These are built, well to spec. The one's I have here are about 4.5 degrees but when I do the same with the lower it will be around 7.

The camber is fine tuned with the threaded rod ends and since the rod ends are slightly more narrow then the frame openings, it allows shims for fine tuning caster.

The new drawings I hope to cut this week are trimmed up a little. After building a set I hope to make the second set look a little cleaner. Just looking forward to the simplicity of the hole thing.
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I tell you really pisses me off, I had a hiccup with the MG. I have the engine out working on it today. I am converting it from FI to carb so it may be a larger project then I wanted.

It isn't what I wanted to work on right now...but....I go out with a cup of coffee. I start on a project, turn around, and I can't find the damn coffee!! I have no idea where it went!!! I have not moved that far!! I can EVEN SMELL IT!!
I did that very thing with my sunglasses the other day. Walked in the shop from being out in the bright sun and when headed back outside I realized I did not have my sunglasses. Headed back in the shop, searched around and finally found them on top of my head. Too many projects and things going on at once – I guess.
"It isn't what I wanted to work on right now...but....I go out with a cup of coffee. I start on a project, turn around, and I can't find the damn coffee!! I have no idea where it went!!! I have not moved that far!! I can EVEN SMELL IT!!"

Gary you're cracking me up....hopefully you didn't have the cylinder head off and left your coffee cup inside the cylinder? Imagine the racket when the motor is fired for the first time! So glad there are others going through this too. My wife has a tendency to clean up after me... I'll put something down knowing that in 5 minutes when I ready to leave the items is sitting by my car keys (but my wife doesn't like a distributor sitting on the kitchen counter top (whats wrong with her?))....When I come back to leave my keys are still there and I'm wondering what I did with the distributor...am I going nuts? So being in my early 50's I'm thinking "SOB my memory is getting reeeeaally bad". But after a few times of realizing my wife moved it, I've gotten to the point where I'll just ask my wife where it WENT...unfortunately for her she now gets blamed for some of the stuff I forget.

Like I said Gary I want to be your neighbor someday so I can come to your garage to just hang and learn all your tricks...it's awesome that you spend so much time sharing all the great things you are doing to your car with us mortals!

I love the A-arms...having the adjustment at the attachment points is a great idea. I've not gotten to that project yet but your solution is a good one...so when are you going into production to sell your custom parts?
You know working on R/C airplanes for years. I would sit at a table with an Xacto knife and it would disappear. It happened a 1000x. I would not get up, I would not move yet it was gone. I only stabbed it in my leg once.


quote:
Originally posted by Tom@Seal Beach:
I love the A-arms...having the adjustment at the attachment points is a great idea. I've not gotten to that project yet but your solution is a good one...so when are you going into production to sell your custom parts?


My real problem is working on Pantera's in the middle of nowhere. I can mock up a part on my car but I don't think that is adequate testing for a part. Knowing that parts are not our bread and butter, I am on the fence as to if I really want to make parts. What I need is to team up with a vendor who can try the parts on cars that go through their shop. That way they can say either "that sucks" or "we'll sell a 100 of those".
Gary,

I see your dilemma on building Pantera parts without testing them. Also, I have had a few things that I thought, “I probably could sell this if I made more” but the problem, in my mind, is that the demand is not high enough for as few of cars that were ever produced and the amount of them left on the road.

Would you consider selling the laser cut pieces and letting the buyer weld up their own a-arms from your templates?
quote:
Originally posted by Garvino:
Gary,

I see your dilemma on building Pantera parts without testing them. Also, I have had a few things that I thought, “I probably could sell this if I made more” but the problem, in my mind, is that the demand is not high enough for as few of cars that were ever produced and the amount of them left on the road.

Would you consider selling the laser cut pieces and letting the buyer weld up their own a-arms from your templates?


Absolutely. Would love to get some one else s take on them. I need to get this next set cut and welded to see if I got everything tweaked the way I need it.
quote:
Originally posted by comp2:
Absolutely. Would love to get some one else s take on them. I need to get this next set cut and welded to see if I got everything tweaked the way I need it.


Gary,

I would like to give the laser cut pieces a try once you get your protype sorted out. I'll be happy to pay for metal, shipping, time, etc. Let me know if I can be of any assitance.
quote:
Originally posted by Garvino:
quote:
Originally posted by comp2:
Absolutely. Would love to get some one else s take on them. I need to get this next set cut and welded to see if I got everything tweaked the way I need it.


Gary,

I would like to give the laser cut pieces a try once you get your protype sorted out. I'll be happy to pay for metal, shipping, time, etc. Let me know if I can be of any assitance.


I will let you know. I have been thinking of selling them as kits.
Gary, are saying that just the top A-arm can be swapped out (using your possible kit)to get 4 degrees of caster and you going to re-engineer the bottom A-arm to get it to 7 degrees total caster?

I'd be interested in a set of uppers also. What kind of bushing material do you have for the rod end? How flexible are they? I'm thinking about 4-6 degrees on caster but a bushing could be the limiting factor. It looks like you could also us a set of rod ends which would allow quite a bit of adjust-ability. Only problem is there's no give to the rod ends and not sure how good that would be on a street car.
Gary, Your arms are looking good mate. You say at 5 degrees you where beginning to hit the rear fenderwell? I have run up to 7 degrees on narrow cars and factory GT5 and 5S without any clearance problems. It must be your wheel back spacing causing that?
I have found 6 degrees works well on wide cars.
The Mangusta used rod ends on it's upper front arm and they dont feel harsh.

Johnny
I am going to wait for a little bit before I offer them. I have a couple out right now and I just want to make sure everything goes smoothly with them. They are extremely time consuming to make. Feedback is important. If anyone has any issues I need to address what I have out there right away. I don't expect any but I want to be cautious.
quote:
....This was also one of my issues for making a-arms. Every car seems to be a little different.


That's what happened constantly to Gary Hall. He'd get someone to make a widget for his car, try it and say,'Geez- that's neat! I'll bet I could sell a bunch of these!" So they would make a couple of dozen that fit Gary's '72 just fine... but needed work to fit any other year Pantera. So Gary would be mystified and the customers (some, anyway) would be P.O-ed. IMHO, expecting ANYTHING to just bolt onto a mostly hand-built 43 year old sports car with a questionable background (unless you bought it new) is wishful thinking. That's why I own a machine & welding shop.
quote:
Originally posted by PanteraDoug:
quote:
Originally posted by comp2:
quote:
Originally posted by Kjeld Pedersen:
Sorry Gary not Gery
Thumbs Up!
Kjeld


I answer to a lot of names....and Gerry is not one of the bad ones.

I might have something which might get it going but I can't say yet.


Big Grin
Pantera Doug answers to More names than a guy named "John" at a Nevada Whore house...Mark
If you could incorporate an adjuster sleeve into your design, it would make on the car adjustments much easier. The picture shows one that I made up. The sleeve is right-hand threaded on the outside and left-hand threaded on the inside. Just loosen the jam nuts, turn the adjuster one way or the other, in or out, and retighten the nuts.

Mike Mileski
Tucson, AZ

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Hi Gery.

Any update.
Are you interested in selling the fixture and the lasercut pieces, so i can build my own arms.

Smiler

Kjeld

quote:
Originally posted by comp2:
quote:
Originally posted by Kjeld Pedersen:
Sorry Gary not Gery
Thumbs Up!
Kjeld


I answer to a lot of names....and Gerry is not one of the bad ones.

I might have something which might get it going but I can't say yet.
Kjeld,

It has been a long time since I have done anything with the A-arm stuff I don't plan on continuing it. If the Pantera's were as active in my neck of the woods as they were in other areas such as California, I would have a base to test it better and to work with it; that and I am neck deep into some other products.

As far as the building rig I am willing to give that to anyone who can use it but I don't think you want to pay shipping on that to Denmark.

Let me send you a pm

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