Headlight bucket & bracket alignment

was your Pantera into the past into an accident ?

why was the bracket cut and rewelded ?

It's an indication from former damage when the headlights openings /caps not are the same.

and thats for all models.

Simon 

Hi Simon,

Yes, at some point in it's past the passenger front fender was replaced. There was left rear wheel well damage from a broken half shaft as well that was probably the cause of an accident. I fixed all that already.

I'm just now trying to tackle the correct alignment of tbe headlight buckets to their openings. They both looked good and centered when down, but when up the buckets were not at the same level to the opening & the gaps between the healight & fenders were different when viewed from inside the car. Time to get it all corrected as I work towards getting it repainted.

I though it would be as simple as centering the bracket & bucket in the hole with the bar at it's down limit. Then just weld the bracket to the bar. Doing this worked for keeping it centered when closed, but when up the bucket cannot clear the hole to be flush with the lip of the opening.

Perhaps a bar location issue if it had been replaced & it's off a bit? Or is it normal for the headlight bucket to not fully clear the opening & be below the opening a little when up?

My headlight buckets clear the opening, but only barely. They are pretty close to flush.

The headlight bucket base should be essentially flush with the fender opening when up.  If your buckets are both flush when down  and resting on the rubber stops but off by an inch from one another when up, then the bucket itself is either bent or your one fender is misshaped somehow.  It is also possible that the buckets themselves changed in dimension over time and your one bucket different in size from the other.   Did you measure the actual dimensions of both buckets?

Thanks for the info. I will check & compare measurments tonight. I'll also reinstall the one bucket to show how far off it is.

I know one bucket has the correct  vin# stamped on it. Should they both have it if original?

Yes, both should be stamped

When there is a wrong bucket ( from an early build Pantera you can see this easy because the gaps , but it's possible the fill the caps with bondo.

think your problem is the fender , maybe not good installed/welded or it has a big dent.

US carshops usual use more filler on a car than on a house .

when everything looks OK, than your problem is the bracket between barr and bucket .

when you grind this backet from the barr and bring it a little to the front of the car, maybe 1/2 inch and a little upwards than the headlight goes closer to the fender when they are open.

easy to say , but takes hours of adjustment.

also it;s possible your bucket has a dent on the area where the bucket meets the bracket.

I just was restoring a 72 Pantera, 2 different front fenders , when I bought this the headlight system was deleted.

I bring back everything as stock, but it was taken a couple of days of thinking , adjusting , welding, grinding apart, and again, and  again.

Simon

when there was bucket replaced after an accident or damaged from rust  the new one is not stamped.

I verified both buckets are original to the car & have not been modified. Headlight holes are also correct. So it now begs the question, how to get them both centered when closed & up flush when open.

After looking at it more, I think I can now see what I need to do. The brackets welded to the bar need to be at a different angle & raised up a little. This should allow the bucket to clear the opening & remain centered when closed.

Here is the passenger side, showing how low it sits in the hole with the up limit almost maxed out. So, the bracket needs to be moved back & angled up slightly...I think. I'll mock it up tomorrow & see how it lines up. I'm sure it'll be a process until I get it just right.

If that is the case, then they will not sit correctly when closed.  You can test that by simply shimming the lower or upper edge of the bucket with washers.  Changing the angle when open means the same applies when closed.  

I agree with what you said. By angle change, what I really meant is, the bracket will be rotated up some (relocated on the bar) to allow the bucket to come up flush. To achieve this, the bucket will also need to be moved straight up to allow more clearance to the fender as it fully opens. The angle of the bracket to bar will not change, just the final up position of the bracket will look more rotated (different angle) than it is now when fully up.

I did a quick mock up & it will all align like I described by relocating the bracket on the bar.

Another thing I noticed, with where the bracket is now, when fully up the headlight motor teeth were at the very end (almost off) of the teeth on the bar bracket. I will position the bar where it's not on the last tooth when fully up before I set the relocation of the headlight bracket on the bar. I have more adjustment on the lower limit to move it down more. When closed, I have 4-5 teeth before the last tooth.

The buckets move in a confined arc, so if you are at the limit of adjustment when up on the limit switch, then the bar needs rotating in relation to the gear piece (cut and weld). I assume you have plenty of adjustment on the lower limit switch (closed position stop), so you can adjust the close position back with that. It's really about getting the gear drive centered on the motor drive when the buckets are halfway open and then you'll have some adjustment in the open and closed positions. Of course you should also check the headlight beam is correct, but that is adjustable at the sealed beam under the trim with 3 screws.

For adjustment of the bucket position in the opening, the buckets are bolted to a bracket on the rod and can be accessed from inside the fender to adjust side to side or front to back slightly. If one bucket is slightly out in relation to the other you can shim a little between the bucket and bracket as well.

Yeah, the bucket bracket had previously been remounted in the wrong spot, thus not allowing any further rotational up due to being at the end of the travel on the teeth.  The bracket needs to be cut off the bar & relocated correctly & like you said, where it's in the middle of the teeth travel when half way up. Could also cut the bar & rotate it,  but the correct way woukd be to just properly relocate the bracket on the bar.

One option that hasn’t been mentioned here, is to eliminate the bar entirely and raise/lower the headlamp buckets individually, with linear actuators. I personally know two Pantera owners who have done this and both were very happy with the way it worked out.

Took way too long, but I got the driver side bucket now flush when up & centered when closed. To achieve this though, the gap between the fender & headlight is a lot more since I had to move it up, but It's the only way I got it to work with the arc the bracket is on when the bar rotates. I've seen quite a difference in pics of other cars, so I'm not sure if mine is that abnormal, but twice the gap I had before.

The important things (IMHO) are that the buckets are flush when closed, and don’t hit anything when opened, and the beams are adjusted properly.

You only use the headlights in the dark, so no one sees the alignment between the two.

I think it looks great.  Wonder what caused the misalignment?

I agree with Rocky,

Simon

Looks like a normal gap. The opening is not very precise.

@husker posted:

Looks like a normal gap. The opening is not very precise.

the cap on the pictures is acceptable for me.

when you have a unmolested headlight system and no former damage on the fenders , the buckets  have an almost perfect fit  , open and closed..

Simon