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I plan to go through the brakes on 1332 in the next few weeks.  The car stops ok but the emergency brake is not working.  It has been 10 years since the brakes were touched so I figured I would do the following but before (I usually seek advice after) I jump in, I would create a post to see what others thought.

I plan to pull the wheels, drain all the brake fluid, examine all the calipers, clean and rebuild if needed.  I plan to keep the stock brake calipers, replace pads if needed, figure out exactly how the e-brake works and fix, then assemble, fill fluid, then bleed.  I will post pics

Thank you in advance for any sage advice

Last edited by George P
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In my personal opinion and experience, "figure out exactly how the e-brake works and fix" may be optimistic.  Be careful to not over-tighten its range of motion, as you may boil your brake fluid on one or both rear wheels (easily diagnosed and addressed, but discovering that on an interstate highway in traffic is unnerving, don't ask me how I know).  Apparently these days there are better solutions, generally requiring some money.  Some have adapted a Tesla e-brake though some of that seems to have become relegated to salvage yard parts and which sources are maybe drying up, or (probably better) contact Scott at saccrestorations.com.  My current car has been converted to probably a Hall line-lock e-brake (that's basically just a forklift brake), a system never designed to truly hold on any incline for any length of time given the weight of a Pantera.  I realize there are some Panteras whose stock e-brake systems magically seem to work as intended, but I suspect they are in the minority.  Short of finding one of those true solutions, I personally recommend a couple of basic wheel chocks for when it really matters, for now (Harbor Freight has a collapsible set that's cheap).  And park it in a gear, of course.  Everything else you wrote sounds good to me.  You can find threads relating to both the Tesla and Scott's e-brake system here.  Another consideration could be, if you choose a more modern solution, you could probably cut out the stock e-brake bracket and crossmember on and between the frame rails and install a removable crossmember to allow you to later drop the oil pan if you ever wanted to.  I should also mention that Porterfield brake pads (I want to say RS-4 off the top of my head) can noticeably improve stock brake performance).  I think you would want to request ones with welded "tabs" to lock into the slots in the calipers.

Last edited by buttondoor

I concur with Rene.  I have put the $30 kit into three Panteras fairly recently and all went well.  You really have to stretch the rubber dust cover on one side and might tear it.  If so, just get another kit.

In all three cars the parking brake holds adequately on a hill (my driveway is sloped) although It is best to leave the car in gear as a backup as mentioned above.

From someone who's restored hundreds of Pantera-Girling calipers in the past, a few tips. First, do NOT split the front caliper halves unless absolutely necessary. The two halves are sealed with a hard-to-find and unbelievably expensive square Viton o-ring. Round ones of the same size WILL NOT WORK. That o-ring is NOT in the rebuild kits  You'll also need a torque wrench and a metric allen socket to bolt the halves together again.

Next, the white nylon sliding parts in the rear calipers are now quite brittle so handle/stress them as little as possible. While the rear calipers are 'easier' to rebuild, almost all the parts are left or right hand mirror images and cannot be swapped from side to side. So it's incredibly easy to wind up with a set of four perfectly home-rebuilt brakes that are missing one, little bitty piece for just one brake..... that is unavailable.

Frozen bleeder screws (from apparently NEVER having been bled?) snap off an inch inside castings during removal and almost cannot be drilled out without buggering up the needle seats. I used a precision milling machine and still lost a few caliper halves. I also used gallons of Knock-em-Loose penetrating oil, not some home-made mix, and very high quality U.S-made 1/4" hex sockets on stuck bleeder screws, NOT Vice-grips or tiny open end wrenches. And I also used real U.S-made metric line-wrenches, often with Vice-grips clamped across the line wrench jaws. Because even high quality line wrench jaws in this size will open enough under removal torque to round off the soft metric hydraulic fittings. There are more gotcha's in restoring these overstressed 50-yr old safety parts.

And if all seems lost and your car still needs brakes, you have two (2.0) further choices. Either substitute an aftermarket caliper kit (which are better and half the weight), or call Larry Stock at PanteraParts.com who rebuilds Pantera/Girling calipers. He will (mostly) take your filthy OEM parts as cores if not broken, and sell you nice clean pro-rebuilt Girlings reasonably priced, with all missing pieces restored including NEW caliper lines & fittings. Its nice to have choices- good luck.       

When I separated my stock front caliper halves in 2019 because it was absolutely necessary in order to completely clean the bores, I then installed these caliper seals from Pegasus.

https://www.pegasusautoracing....tails.asp?RecID=1144

Now 3 years, 3500 miles, and more than a dozen "hare group" Breakfast Club Rallys later, no leaks, no drips, no errors and braking is still strong, straight and true.     YMMV

IMG_2129-1

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  • IMG_2129-1

When I tore down my front calipers for rebuilding I encountered the rust pitted pistons problem. A little searching about and I found that 1979 to 89 Toyota Hilux/FourRunner front calipers have the same staggered bore sizes as the Girlings. So I bought a set off Ebay and stripped them for the parts I needed.

For about $100 I got eight new pistons and rubber parts that fit perfectly.

Only caveat is that the Toyota pistons are just a little bit shorter than the Girlings, and if you elect to split your Girlings, you will need the pegasus seals.

Good luck.

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  • Hilux caliper
Last edited by larryw

Thank you all.  Super helpful.  Today I started with the drivers rear.  Disassembly went surprisingly easy.  The caliper is disassembled, and things looked good.  The mechanism that actuates the emergency brake is still very difficult to actuate.  Is this adjustable or how scary is it to disassemble/reassemble? Once I get that working "properly" I think I should purchase a brake hone and hone the surface slightly and polish the cylinders a little.  Then reassemble.  I have a kit with new seals ready to go.  Mike Dailey's site was very helpful.

If you decide to open up the piston, this is what you'll find.

1. Removing the internals requires extracting the circlip pictured above the slotted 'hat' at the top of the photo. I compressed the assembly just a bit in a vise and with enough cussing I eventually got the circlip out using two small screwdrivers.

Before reassembling I enhanced the notch at the end of the circlip with a grinder to make it easier to get out next time, if that ever happens.

2. DO NOT twist the slack adjuster body as you pull it out of the piston or you WILL break the small tang seen in the second photo. Unreplaceable, and essential for proper operation of the e brake.

3. Inside the bore seen in the second photo there lives an O ring seal that does not come in any vendors rebuild kits.

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  • brake internals 1
  • brake internals 2
Last edited by larryw

About two weeks ago I replaced the rubber and pads in a pair of fronts.  It went well except that I damaged one of the piston seals while installing the pistons that resulted in a leak.  I had a spare kit on hand and was able to find the damaged seal and replace it quickly.  The damaged seal had a small chunk missing as a result of using too much force to push the piston in.

Last edited by stevebuchanan

I just want to add something about the parking brake mechanism:

The parking brake is self adjusting by means of a ratchet mechanism between the two pistons. This mechanism allows for compensation of brake pad wear.

The assembly shown in Larry`s photo contains a small collet with a very fine thread:

On my car the parking brake was not working because the thread on this collet was damaged - no pressure could be applied to the brake pad when the parking brake was pulled. Obviously, someone had tried to push the rear caliper pistons back without turning the outer piston by 45°.

So if you separate the pistons as shown above, please check those threads for deformations:

Unfortunately, I couldn`t find this collet anywhere. So I had it re-manufactured.

If anyone needs this collet, please contact me for technical drawings.

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  • rear caliper pistons separated
  • detail: damaged collet thread
Last edited by benzol

I am curious why you chose to fabricate the damaged Collett. Perhaps such fabrication was readily available and affordable?

Here in the states, I know I am not the only owner that has some orphaned rear brake calipers. I would’ve been happy to disassemble one, and ship a good collet to you for the cost of the postage.

I don’t know how quickly the fabrication was completed, but a small padded envelope probably gets to Germany in two weeks or less.

just wanted to put this out should you, Or other European owners, have similar parts needed in the future.

Larry

@lf-tp2511 posted:

I am curious why you chose to fabricate the damaged Collett. Perhaps such fabrication was readily available and affordable?

Here in the states, I know I am not the only owner that has some orphaned rear brake calipers. I would’ve been happy to disassemble one, and ship a good collet to you for the cost of the postage.

I don’t know how quickly the fabrication was completed, but a small padded envelope probably gets to Germany in two weeks or less.

just wanted to put this out should you, Or other European owners, have similar parts needed in the future.

Larry

Larry, thanks for your offer to provide parts out of your oem calipers

The simple reason why I chose to remanufacture the collet was that I could have it done at my job. However, it was a bit of a challenge as the thread profile is not symmetric.

I also had the information that the rear brake caliper was from the Peugeot 504. However, an old Peugeot mechanic told me that the internal bits were no longer available. The source I checked was this shop.



@dipascale posted:

I can find the inner piston here, but not the internal bits of the parking brake mechanism:

https://www.serie04.com/gb/504...-piston-girling.html

It would be good to know if anyone still has these parts in stock and can overhaul the caliper if those internal parts are defective

I have read more than once that the handbrake of the Pantera does not work as intended. I suspect the reason is simply improper maintenance - it is common for mechanics to do brake servicing without having read the instructions.

I live in a very mountainous area and I think there is nothing to complain about the original handbrake if it is internally intact - except for the very unergonomic position of the handbrake lever

Happy new year!

Philipp

Last edited by benzol

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