Explain the differences between a US Pantera and my European Pantera

If the floors and sills are bad, you want to give the rear suspension mounting points a good look, the rear subframe is one of the more susceptible areas to rust. Obviously if the suspension mounting is rusted badly, the car will be a liability to drive.

Your car should be a Euro GTS, which means it will have a larger rear anti-sway bar, no spacers in the shock absorbers, different brakes, different headers and tail pipes, a Holley carburetor, you may or may not have the rear uprights with the beefier rear wheel bearings, that one I'm fuzzy on.

Do your seats have seat back angle adjusters?

cowboy from hell

Joe
Out of curiousity is this the Pantera you bought?


http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewIte...0133405593&rd=1&rd=1

Yup - That's the one. I have already read the posts of members here and their opinions on the car. Personally, I've seen a lot worse. My '66 K-code needed new floors front and rear, lower quarters and trunk floor. I also had to patch one of the front frame rails and replace both rear. It was a Northern car and rusted from the bottom up.

From what I can tell, this car will need rockers, sills and floors. The other rust prone areas don't look so bad. I don't think this was ever a Northern car. There is some rust in some of the non-structural areas, but that can be taken car of during the body work phase.

I plan to strip the car to a shell and start over (as I do with all my cars). As far as I'm concerned, this is a blank slate and I don't have to worry about originality (as with a Mustang).

I don't have the car here to check for any GTS specific items. I know someone had already concluded that it was not a GTS. I guess I will have to wait until I take delivery to nail everything down.

Well it should definately be a fun time. Take lots of pics on your progress. I for one will be interested in the build process as I know others here will be too.

how much of the work will you be doing yourself and how much will be farmed out?

Good Luck.

Generally, I strip the car to a rolling shell, pull the engine, interior, etc. I have two good friends who own a body/resto shop and they treat me right. Once we get it to their shop, we'll pull the suspension and wheels and put the car on a rotisserie. They will handle the fabrication and paint. Meanwhile, I will tear down the engine and see what kind of shape its in. I have never worked on a ZF (only toploaders), but I guess there's a first time for everything. I'll blast and paint all the suspension parts, etc. Once I get the car back from paint its just a big jigsaw puzzle.

I will definitely have to do something with the interior. The original upholstery is just plain ugly.

My assumption that the car is a Euro GTS is based on the fact that it would make no sense to import a Ford Spec Pantera from Europe to country that has 5000 of them already!

But then again, it makes no sense to allow a rare car to decay into that rusty condition either.

good luck.

looking at the ebay pictures, the car has the leather upholstered dash of a GTS, but the rear valence panel has two holes where the L model bumper mounts protruded.

No info on the car in the BVE registry.

If you bring this car back from its rust bucket condition to a sound car, you'll have my deepest respect and thanks.

cowboy from hell

quote:

Originally posted by Joe6pack:
I don't have the car here to check for any GTS specific items. I know someone had already concluded that it was not a GTS. I guess I will have to wait until I take delivery to nail everything down.

That was me Joe. I based that on the fact it didn't have the fiberglass fenderflare, which are just fake cause they are riveted on and the standard fenders are underneath, and the trim was painted black on GTS. Also GTS had a clock in the dash. These are all minor details and in europe I guess you could order your car any way you wanted it.
BTW, God bless you Joe six pack. If more Pantera people had the raw courage and determination that you have displayed, there would be a hell of a lot less cars lost to the ravages of time. You are now my new hero because you took a car that was a goner and made it right.

George,
What is the "BVE" registry? European?

lazy guys way of writing Bill Van Ess

quote:

Originally posted by Cowboy from Hell:
looking at the ebay pictures, the car has the leather upholstered dash of a GTS, but the rear valence panel has two holes where the L model bumper mounts protruded.cowboy from hell

If you look at the close-up pictures of the headlight area, you can see 2 holes that have filler popping out. Those were L bumper attach holes.

A couple of comments I found on my Euro GTS.

My Euro Car has a wider rear license plate indentation. The car in the pic has a small indentation.

My Euro Car didnt come with holes for large for bumpers. Some one cut them in when the car was shipped to the US.

The guages were all in Metric.

The Euro Cars had nicer interiors .. when Ford got their hands in the mix the sold VINYL in the US.

Ron

glad to see that car found a good home!

i am down in Savannah and was really pondering it!

please let us know how your work progresses, i hope to be purchasing 1 of 2 cars this weekend!

Michael

I should be able to get this car in my garage in the next week or so. I spent today helping my buds move into their new shop which is a lot closer to my house. They should be up and running in the next week or so. I have a '65 Mustang convertible that I need to sell in the next couple of weeks. But first, it needs to go back to my friends shop for some final touch up. I also have a '69 Mach I 428 Cobra Jet that I just bought as a project. I just sold my K-code Fastback GT and was going to sell the '65 'vert and then move to the Cobra Jet. But, then I found this car. I have put the Cobra Jet on Ebay, but I don't expect it to sell for what I have in it. Therefore, I am probably going to have to finish the Cobra Jet and put the Pantera on the back burner. None the less, I will have the car in my posession soon and will begin to decipher just what I have.

Thanks for all the positive comments.

Take Care,

John

Do you have any pics of the Cobra Jet and a cost your asking. send to ronmarl@optonline.net

Ron

Its on Ebay. Item #320130072412.

Bidding seems very active. 10 bids in two days among 4 bidders.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1969-Ford-Mustang-Mach-I...QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Yeah, but I still don't think the car will meet reserve although the high bidder wants it pretty badly. The CJ market is down and these cars are expensive to restore properly. The parts are available, but they are expensive. If it doesn't sell, I will go ahead and finish it. The incorrect shortblock is probably the biggest problem. A correct shortblock is in the neighborhood of $4K.

Well, as some may have guessed, I sold the CJ. I have already begun stripping 5443. Here are a few observations. This car appears to have originally been imported to Germany. It has a metal tag riveted to the right front front wheelwell inside the bonnet. The tag is in German and includes the VIN, etc. Looks like some sort of registration.

The car was originally orange, then a hideous Kermit green and finally the poor Earl Scheib silver and black you see.

It does have the L rear bumber. In front someone pointed out what they thought was bondo where an L front bumper was located. In fact, those are knockouts like you might see in an electrical enclosure.

The engine is likely not original. It has what appears to be a partial VIN stamped on the back of the block from what is likely a '73 H-Code Mustang. It does have a Holley carb and headers. It also has an aftermarket Edelbrock aluminum intake.

I still don't know if its a GTS or not. What would be the single easiest way to tell?

I'll post a few pics later to show my progress.

Good for you Joe !!!

Well done to have the desire and means to bring another DeT car back into the community.

B.G.

quote:

I still don't know if its a GTS or not. What would be the single easiest way to tell?

The clock above the glove box.

Good luck with your project Joe!

quote:

I still don't know if its a GTS or not. What would be the single easiest way to tell?

Take a magnet and put it on the upper wheel arch on the fender. If it sticks it is an L, if it falls off it is a GTS. Back in the old days, europeon drivers could get the L, GTS, Grp3, and or the Grp4 or GT4. It just MIGHT be a Grp3, which is the lowest volume car of all. If it does turn out to be a Grp 3, you may want to talk to Dave Adler. I guess they only made two or three of them, but I am not sure. They made about 25 or so Grp 4,s but I know for sure that isn't a Grp 4.