Hello
I'm still building my gr4 Pantera, what would be your advice about the clutch system ?
target 410-430 HP
regards
Philippe
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For that kind of HP, virtually any clutch will handle it.
Stock would be fine and you could even use a rebuild unit.
If you can find a "Ford Rebuilder" in France, they could rebuild your stock unit for you.
This all means you could be saving $200 to $300 and you would have about a "stock" feel to the clutch pedal since high pressure wouldn't be required.
This is also great for the mechanisms that connect the clutch pedal to the throw-out bearing as well as far as reducing wear on the components.
Even the stock iron flywheel is fine as well.
Stock would be fine and you could even use a rebuild unit.
If you can find a "Ford Rebuilder" in France, they could rebuild your stock unit for you.
This all means you could be saving $200 to $300 and you would have about a "stock" feel to the clutch pedal since high pressure wouldn't be required.
This is also great for the mechanisms that connect the clutch pedal to the throw-out bearing as well as far as reducing wear on the components.
Even the stock iron flywheel is fine as well.
Philippe,
For a pure track car, you want the clutch and flywheel to be as light as possible, so the engine revs quickly. That means a pure racing multi-disc clutch/flywheel combo from Tilton or Quartermaster, etc. The car won't pull away from a dead stop very well but the engine will rev quicker. For street and track use, a great alternative is McLeod part # 30048-5A. It's a single disc, 10.5" diaphragm pressure plate with an aluminum pressure ring, so it's very light. Combined with an aluminum flywheel, it's about the lightest clutch/flywheel combo that's still very streetable. I have one in my street driven Pantera with a plain organic faced disc and a 157 tooth aluminum flywheel. It's in McLeod's racing catalog and last I checked, the pressure plate was a little over $500.
For a pure track car, you want the clutch and flywheel to be as light as possible, so the engine revs quickly. That means a pure racing multi-disc clutch/flywheel combo from Tilton or Quartermaster, etc. The car won't pull away from a dead stop very well but the engine will rev quicker. For street and track use, a great alternative is McLeod part # 30048-5A. It's a single disc, 10.5" diaphragm pressure plate with an aluminum pressure ring, so it's very light. Combined with an aluminum flywheel, it's about the lightest clutch/flywheel combo that's still very streetable. I have one in my street driven Pantera with a plain organic faced disc and a 157 tooth aluminum flywheel. It's in McLeod's racing catalog and last I checked, the pressure plate was a little over $500.
Absolutely love my McCleod.
Thanks
Did someone try some machining a stock flywheel to lighten it ?
Is it worth the effort ?
regards
Philippe
Did someone try some machining a stock flywheel to lighten it ?
Is it worth the effort ?
regards
Philippe
The 289hp flywheel will fit the car. Offhand I can't tell you what it weighs but I'm thinking it is less than 30 pounds.
It will balance into the assembly and you certainly could use the matching Ford clutch for it BUT there are other considerations here.
Removing mass from the recipricating assembly of a Cleveland means that you have to stay under about 6,000 rpms.
The particular design of the Cleveland makes it develop "harmonics", i.e., self destructing vibrations, over that engine speed.
The only way you can quiet that is to ADD more mass to it, not deduct it.
This is CLEARLY shown in the use of the Boss balancer.
In lightening the reciprocating assembly, you probably should stick to using the aluminum pressure plate, titanium connecting rods, lightened pistons and MAYBE lightening the throws in the crankshaft, MAYBE?
Don't be surprised though if you need to add Mallory metal to get the engine to balance even if you internally balance this thing?
Even there though you are on your own as to what you have done to the longevity of this engine.
That is all out of the book of the old "Pro stock" drag racing and you are most likely putting yourself into blowing up an engine every so often or after a certain amount of runs? Maybe after every 10 runs you change engines BEFORE it blows up and turns it into scrap metal?
Sure there are a bunch of guys out there running aluminum flywheels and regular 4v balancers.
If you ask me, I wouldn't drive one. It is just an explosion waiting to happen.
Boom. Big bada-boom.
As with anything like this, proceed at your own risks. When the thing blows up, then you will say, "huh, he was right?"
It will balance into the assembly and you certainly could use the matching Ford clutch for it BUT there are other considerations here.
Removing mass from the recipricating assembly of a Cleveland means that you have to stay under about 6,000 rpms.
The particular design of the Cleveland makes it develop "harmonics", i.e., self destructing vibrations, over that engine speed.
The only way you can quiet that is to ADD more mass to it, not deduct it.
This is CLEARLY shown in the use of the Boss balancer.
In lightening the reciprocating assembly, you probably should stick to using the aluminum pressure plate, titanium connecting rods, lightened pistons and MAYBE lightening the throws in the crankshaft, MAYBE?
Don't be surprised though if you need to add Mallory metal to get the engine to balance even if you internally balance this thing?
Even there though you are on your own as to what you have done to the longevity of this engine.
That is all out of the book of the old "Pro stock" drag racing and you are most likely putting yourself into blowing up an engine every so often or after a certain amount of runs? Maybe after every 10 runs you change engines BEFORE it blows up and turns it into scrap metal?
Sure there are a bunch of guys out there running aluminum flywheels and regular 4v balancers.
If you ask me, I wouldn't drive one. It is just an explosion waiting to happen.
Boom. Big bada-boom.
As with anything like this, proceed at your own risks. When the thing blows up, then you will say, "huh, he was right?"
Doug, thanks
Since I'm not totally idiot I'll follow advices ...
I'm building a gr4 car
The engine was coming with the car ...
It's a 351ci block, with a custom camshaft from Brent Lykins (target 3500-6500 power band)
Quickfuel race carb on a Dominator intake, 180° headers, custom dizzy with MSD capacitor ignition, 10/1 CR, crane rocker arms, Pioneer race balancer (adviced on it)...
Aviaid baffled oil pan.
I would ask for an oil pump and then hope I will get 400+ HP pretty reliable, I've looked around on the web, and asked. Everybody has it's own idea, so if I'm completely wrong, it's time to act before mounting the engine in the car
Kind regards
Philippe
Since I'm not totally idiot I'll follow advices ...
I'm building a gr4 car
The engine was coming with the car ...
It's a 351ci block, with a custom camshaft from Brent Lykins (target 3500-6500 power band)
Quickfuel race carb on a Dominator intake, 180° headers, custom dizzy with MSD capacitor ignition, 10/1 CR, crane rocker arms, Pioneer race balancer (adviced on it)...
Aviaid baffled oil pan.
I would ask for an oil pump and then hope I will get 400+ HP pretty reliable, I've looked around on the web, and asked. Everybody has it's own idea, so if I'm completely wrong, it's time to act before mounting the engine in the car
Kind regards
Philippe
You should have no problem with your goals. It is probably between 400 and 450 hp.
thanks Doug
I'm opening a new thread to discuss this engine
I'm opening a new thread to discuss this engine
quote:Originally posted by 4NHOTROD:
Absolutely love my McCleod.
Same here!!