cooling

I just finished laying my rad forward, still have a little bleeding to do. The flex-a-lite dual 12" shrouded fans (model 210 or 220) fit like they were designed for the Pantera Radiator and move a ton of air. Summit Racing has them for about 189.

Good Luck
Gary
#06984

Thanks for your reply. Was this an easy installation? did you have any cooling problems before and did this fix it?

If your sticking a thermometer in the resevoir tank; are'nt you keeping the system from pressurizing?? Ofcourse it's going to boil over! The pressure raises the temperature at which the coolant can begin to boil! Or am I reading it wrong, and the themometer is sealed within the cap? Is the restricter/bypass orifice disk installed under the thermastat? Marlin.

[This message has been edited by MARLIN JACK (edited 09-09-2002).]

Take a look at the post this week called "laying the radiator forward (almost)" there is discussion in there about whether or not you have to cut out the platforms for the stock fans Jack says yes Chuck Melton & Allen say no. There was no way it would fit in mine w/o cutting them. I cut them carefully so that they could be put back in if I ever sold my car to a purist. I have had the car since 85 and don't expect to get rid of it anytime soon. The above post also has links to Chuck's article on cooling and pictures of Allen's rad. installed. My car was not overheating, I just wanted to do the update. Also did you mention you were still using a stock rad? there were some problems with them. You might want to invest in a Fluidine aluminum rad. I bought the Phoenix from Hall and the system holds almost 7 gallons. I bought it probably 13 years ago and it is still in great shape although there were some design flaws in it I had to get corrected. After about 4 years the steel strapping that helps hold it together rusted through. After 6 years the steel bottom plate rusted real bad. There was still enough for a metal fabricating shop to duplicate the top & bottom panels out of 1/8" brass. My rad shop put it all back together with stainless strapping and when we had it out last week he inspected it and the inside still looks almost perfect. I told gary about the design defect several years ago, I don't know if he made any changes.

Gary

Jack, what I did was put a themometer into the resovor where the water comes out of the block just up from the thermostat. I left off the cap to check the temp. and compare it to the aftermarket gauge. It's not under pressure but it should mantain a constant temputure sitting at idle. where cap pressure comes in is when you are working your motor. this causes temps to rise because of more friction and heat from gas consumption. Take your family car for example, take the cap off it and let it idle. It will run all day without boling over because the temp. senders turn on and off fans and maintains a constant temp. And with an old engine such as a cleveland any temp. above 210-250 will kill it, even if the mixture in the systems doesn't boil, the rings will lose there spring and pistons will start to egg shape the cyl. walls, and so on. the new engines today don't work the same way. Our fleet mech. check all our trucks this way with the top tank themo.every 3 months. if it boiles over then something is wrong. The restricking washer goes in place of the theromstat and slowes down the water going through the system just like a open theromstat would but it won't trap air because it's always open. I did this to make sure I had all the air out. Gary I still have the original rad. but it's still in great shape and will use it if I can. But if It takes another rad. then I will get one and put it in. Thanks to both of you guys for your responces, I will try to keep you informed on what I find out. everybody on this forum are great people who take time out to help others, that is one reason for my membership and will buy my parts from P.I. we need to support those who support us. THANKS ALL.

There are SO many things that could cause this, I don't believe anyone can diagnose by long-distance such a problem; all we can do is make educated guesses. For instance, one friend went through literally hunderds of dollars with his cooling system, to finally learn that the waffle-pattern cooling fins in his stock radiator had de-soldered from the water tubes! No way would that radiator cool anything bigger than a garden tractor, and yet unless you were actually looking for such a thing, you'd never know what happened. I personally believe any stock 30-yr-old Pantera radiator is junk or close to it. As far as laying your radiator down, this will make zero difference in how it cools; it simply makes working on the backside of the radiator much easier. Mounting is simple: the stock rad' lower pins sit in two holes in platforms underneath, and is held by two brackets up top. To lay the thing down, you unsolder the TOP brackets, reverse them side-for-side AND front-to back, then resolder them. This allows the rad' to lean fwd in the unaltered lower platforms, on stock grommets, and bolt into the stock upper holes. The fwd end of the rad' will be 2-3" away from the front hood crossmember and will need a severely narrowed top air deflector. The stock fan mounts in front can be cut away since more efficiency comes from sucker fans with a shroud on the back of the radiator. Besides, at a 45 degree face angle on a laid-fwd radiator, the stock pusher-fans will be even less efficient than they were originally, with a huge gap below the blades. Be very sure any big fan motors you use (front or back) can pull all the amperage they need; stock fan wiring is often restrictive. This slows the motors & less air is moved. Finally, it's really difficult to thoroughly bleed all the air out of the system, but it IS possible. If you still have problems, e-mail me at jderyke@aol.com and we'll discuss this further.

Jack's description of the radiator mounting is perfect. This is exactly what I was going to do until I took a piece of stainless angle, bent it at approximately a 120� instead of the 90� angle and drilled two holes. One for mounting to the existing lower platforms and one for relocated the stock grommets. This allowed the bottom of the radiator to be moved to the rear of the car and away from the stock fan mounts in the front. I went a little easier and didn't remove the existing upper straps either. I obtained two pieces of thick aluminum strap, the same size and thickness, drilled and mounted one end to the existing straps and leaned the radiator forward as far as I could, then cut off the straps, drilled two new mounting holes in them and "Voila". No cutting, modifying or headaches. The only problem I had was a slight touch to the center of the hood where a slight dent corrected. I possibly could have lowered it a little more but I was tired and didn't care. The new air deflector even fit perfectly.




[This message has been edited by Pantera1252 (edited 09-12-2002).]

Thanks guys, I am going to try a sucker fan on the back and see if this helps. If it does then I will order a twin fan setup and lay the rad. forward. Then I will see if this will do the trick. If it does'nt do it as well as I want(175-185 deg.) I will buy a new rad. and put my new fans on it. Thanks so much for your help.

I want to thank all you guys for your help and to let you know that I have fixed the problem. I found out that the rad. was pluged up. This along with the new flex a lite fans on the back side has made all the differance in the temp. When at idle I let it get to 180 degs. then I turned on the fans and within a few mins. it had droped to 130 degs. And out on the road when I flogged it it never got above 190 degs. I think it is fixed. THANKS Jack And the rest of you guys. Paul.....