Flywheel and Clutch ??

I am not advising anyone what to do on a clutch. I am merly sharing what I know about it.

The Centerforce dual friction clutch for the Pantera is a 10.5" diameter clutch, diaphram type.

The people that I know who use Centerforce dual friction clutches consider them to be limited to about 800hp.

Many Chevy and Ford SB people would prefer to use an 11" disc.

I have that, the 11", in my Shelby with a 347 in it.
So far it hooks up nice and I haven't noticed it slip yet, BUT, the gearing is different then the Pantera.

It has a DougNash 4+1 with a 3.27 first gear and a 3.50 rear. That gives the effect of something like a 5.00:1 rear in first gear.

You don't have to slip the clutch to lauch the car. You just let it out nice and easy and the nose of the car comes up and the 2.95-15-15 tires don't even spin.

The Pantera is a different story. The ZF gearing combination in 1st gear requires a little toe tapping and feathering of the throttle to launch it.

I found that the 11 inch clutch wound slip and the steel flywheel had hot spots on it.

When I swapped engines I used the stock Ford iron flywheel and the Pantera version of the Centerforce which is 10.5".

It seems to hold much better.

I don't know why a smaller clutch seems to hold much better then a larger clutch, I've already been tarred and feathered on this one, but it does SEEM to.

I know it seems illogical.

Since it hasn't been pulled apart I can't see how it is wearing or if the flywheel has hot spots on it.

I can tell you that it has a very nice pedal feel to it. Neither hard nor soft. A kid could drive it.

As to whether or not it is a good race clutch, I simply couldn't tell you. It is nice on the street.

At $600, it isn't the cheap way to go at all but then again the labor to pull these things apart and then put them back together continuously is a lot more then the $200 that you paid more for.

I can tell you that the 10.75" Centerforce dual friction that I put in my SHO lasted about 10,000 miles of normal driving and was completely on the rivets on the flywheel side and had machined itself into the face of the flywheel something like 20 thousands. It is an iron flywheel.

It was a $600 unit also. I was very, very unhappy with that clutch. SHO'S are a nightmare to do a clutch in. About $2500 worth of labor.

I only know a two people who have tried an aluminum flywheel on a Cleveland. I have not.

One still has it in the car and loves it. It's a former 390 67 Mustang with a Cleveland and a TL 4 speed.

He races the car at Lime Rock and loves the "revabilaty" of the car with it.

The other, which was a Falcon Pro street was pulled out for lack of bottom end torque.

To me these are both understandable concerns.

Hope this helps.

Mark ..Doug ..thanks for the reply.

Couple things ..can we agree its a 164 tooth flywheel ?

It does seem everyone mentions centerforce. ..I have always used Mcleod and never a diaphram style ..always Borg and Beck 3 finger style. I was always under the understanding that in a HOT situation like road racing the diagphram looses tention with the heat.

Mcleod has 2 styles STREET TWIN Series which seems to be a double disc clutch that comes with flywheel as an assembly in steel. I justhave to check if its billet or forged. I dont use billet only forged.

They also have a Magnum Force Unit ... seems more for raod racing ..they have a 900lb torque capacity with a double disc.

It seems to me any engine close to 500 ft lbs of torque is going to need a double disc assembly.

Am I on the right track ..with selection.

Ron

I think that you are analysing the situation correctly.

I don't know if the McCloud double disc is overkill, maybe not?

I don't have an available flywheel to go check. I wanna say yes it's a 164 tooth, but I know you own guns.

You have to remember with the Centerforce that you have the additiona balast weights on the fingers that add load under rpm.

Also the fingers are tempered and heat treated.

Not all the mfgs discs are.

Also the Pantera is actually on the easy side to do a clutch on so unfortunately you may have to experiment.

quote:

can we agree its a 164 tooth flywheel ?

Yes.

Call Dennis Quella - Pantera Performance in Castle rock, CO - tell him what your car/engine is like and used for. He will steer you to what you need, not what he wants to sell.

Larry

Ron,

Yep, the flywheel is 164 tooth for the 351C.

PM RoverLTD on the clutch, he has some experience with a dual disc set up. It was a Ram setup (as sold by Dennis Q.) but the second friction disc is not fully floating and requires shimming. Basically he spent 3 years messing around with it before giving up and changing to a Centerforce.

Coz had some bad experiences with McCleod, I think their manufacturing moved offshore and quality dropped. Do a search on previous posts for those discussions.

I do know Centerforce uses a different bolt spacing than stock on the flywheel, so you have to get a flywheel with their clutch (iron, steel or Al available) or have your existing one redrilled and tapped.

Thanks Guys ... I spoke to Quella and he was very helpful. I made some suggestions from my experience with racing and we agreed on the direction to take based on my Hp projections and use of the car ... looks like Mcleod Street Twin Series fit my application with Borg and Beck Style 3 finger Pressure Plate .. and aluminum flywheel.