I believe Number of USA GTS cars produced is 150

Chuck, Where is the BSN located?

Kelly

Kelly,

The Body Service Number (BSN) is located on the footbox, between the main VIN plate and the brake booster.

If you have visited my website before (www.ProvaMo.com) I can point you to a page with photos:

http://www.provamo.com/Members...odySerivceNumber.asp

Regardless, you can contact me directly.
admin @ DeTomasoRegistry.org (Leave out spaces)

Chuck

Hi Chuck,
it is a very interesting question and maybe a difficult one to get a clear answer on! The Marti report I sent to you for my car indicates there were 150 'ordered', whatever that means. The book 'De Tomaso Automobiles' by Wallace Wys (p 122) indicates there were 97 GTS imported to the US... Maybe it is worth contacting one of the 'historians' that have written one of the various books to hear what their research uncovered.
Cheers, Tim.

I've received your Marti, it is GREAT to get confirmation!

I'll be updating your database entry shortly.

I much appreciate your support!

Chuck

chuck.ive had my gts for 33 years. the bsn # is 30126 and the last 4 #s of the vin are #7234. i have only seen one other vin higher than mine and it was #7235 and he had documentation that it was the last gts built. fyi it had 235k miles on it.hope this helps,mike mayberry....

Bill Van Ess also disagreed with the 98 US-GTS figure, he pegged the number at 138. His explanation was there were 40 US-GTS destined for California all re-documented as 1973 models and 98 shipped to the other 49 states that retained their 1974 documentation. So you guys aren't too far apart.

I do not believe US Ford attempted to acquire 1974 California emissions certification for the 351 Cobra Jet (Q code motor), either that or they attempted but failed. I believe in 1974 California was the only state that had its own emissions certification program, federal certification was good enough for the other 49 states (this may still be true). It is my personal suspicion that the motors installed in 1974 Panteras were in fact left-over 1973 models. All 1974 US Ford passenger cars were equipped with solid state ignitions. So I reason (with what mental capacity I have) that if the Pantera motors had been 1974 models they would have been equipped with solid state ignitions too, not dual point distributors. There may not have been a 1974 Q code motor to deliver to California for certification testing. But California was the Panteras biggest market. Since there is no physical difference between a 1973 Pantera & a 1974 Pantera, it was very easy for Ford to re-document the 1974 Panteras destined for California as 1973 models.

The 351 Cobra Jet was US Ford's last performance motor, and in February 1973 US Ford made a clear policy to terminate all financial involvement with performance products, parts or events. Profits were spiraling downward, they were tightening up their budget to spend what money was available on passenger safety and tailpipe emissions. US Ford also wanted an image of a company that was interested only in fuel economy, passenger safety and clean air. This is why I suspect there may not have been any Q code motors manufactured in 1974 even though the various manuals I have in my collection list a Q code motor that year.

The Cobra Jet's lack of certification in California would have also impacted the 1974 Cougar, Torino, Montego and Ranchero models destined for California. There should be 1974 sales literature for those models somewhere verifying the Q code motor was not available in California, if anywhere.

Keep up the good work Chuck, your efforts are appreciated, I'm behind you 100%

-G

I've received additional evidence that the number of USA-GTS cars produced is 150.

So thanks to everyone that is supporting the Registry!

www.DeTomasoRegistry.org

Chuck

Mike,

I now have some photos of Wade's GTS. Can you send me some photos of your car for the registry?

Use
admin@detomasoregistry.org

THANKS!

Chuck

Thanks for the support George (Cowboy). Interesting info on the Q code motor.

boy, talk abour re-writing history...

Congratulations, Chuck on your research.

Also, very interesting info from Mr. Pence.

At the risk of hijacking this thread, let me ask you guys a question.

Every '74 GTS I ever saw here in NY new had 10" Capagnollos on the rear. When the cars were still be supported parts wise by Ford, I went to a dealer and tried to order the 10" wheels for my '73.

They didn't even show as a part listed in the parts books.

I'm confused. I know everyone is now saying that they were only stock on Euro GTS's but in 1975, the dozen or so GTS I saw around here were US cars?

Doug,

It is true that the USA-GTS came with the same 7" front and 8" rear Campys as the rest of the USA cars.

It was/is real common for an owner to move the rear 8" wide Campy to the front, and add the then pseudo-over-the-counter 10" wide Campys to the rear.
Besides improving handling, it just looks better.

I think Gary Hall was one of the people that imported "tons" of 10" Campys, while some Ford dealership parts guys knew and would order/provide these wheels (not listed in the orange Ford parts book), other dealerships preferred to provide blank-stares instead.

I suspect you met the later type.

quote:

Originally posted by Chuck Melton:
Doug,

It is true that the USA-GTS came with the same 7" front and 8" rear Campys as the rest of the USA cars.

It was/is real common for an owner to move the rear 8" wide Campy to the front, and add the then pseudo-over-the-counter 10" wide Campys to the rear.
Besides improving handling, it just looks better.

I think Gary Hall was one of the people that imported "tons" of 10" Campys, while some Ford dealership parts guys knew and would order/provide these wheels (not listed in the orange Ford parts book), other dealerships preferred to provide blank-stares instead.

I suspect you met the later type.

I don't think there was a Hall Pantera in 1974. My parts dealer simply didn't know where to get the wheels from. All he had was the US parts book.

To tell you the truth. I don't remember ever seeing a US GTS WITHOUT 10" Campys?

As far as blank stares? Still get them. One would think that everyone spoke Klingon here? Must be a Mexican thing? Americans just don't want to acknowledge they understand anything else but US English. To me that's just an indication that they are even too stupid to even understand that even just a little?

all U.S. pantera gts models came with 7 and 8 inch campys from the factory.ford never had 10 inch in there parts book.hope this helps, mike mayberry

There were two different parts books around in the '70s, and the one most are familiar with is the U.S version with an orange cover. But there is a 'supplement' that covers Euro cars and includes 10x 15" wheels, Weber intakes and the Gr-3 stuff. I have a copy and lent it to the POCA Store for inclusion in their "everything" CD. Since Ford didn't want to be responsible for racing parts not sold on the cars they were distributing, such parts were sort of unlisted here.
Much of this Euro-only stuff is also shown in the second factory parts book published in 1982 with a black cover. It also lists the GT-5 and -5S car parts.

I would like to have a copy of that one some day.

In my case, since I am talking about cars around the 1974-5 time frame, it most likely was one dealer in my area that was responsible for the US GTS cars with the 10" wheels.

I would take a guess and say that it could have been Bob Grossman in Rockland County, Spring Valley, NY, I think.

He was a Ferari dealer amongst other cars and raced Cobras as well. Maybe even a GT40 thrown in for good measure.

There were two Pantera dealers here that I dealt with then. Both for early cars. Neither ever had GTS or a 74. They were Park LM in Yonkers, and Manor in White Plains, NY.

There were "lots" of Pantera running around here in the mid '70s.

I still remember Park calling me up after I had filled out a coupon for a Pantera brochure and offering me a new white '73 for $5,000 and my '68 Shelby.

It was a good deal, but like my father said to me, "how you gonna' pay for that freakin' thing?"

Jack,

I have the "Euro" or extended parts book on my website, the one with the GR 3 features and parts, including the 10" wide Campys.

Chuck

quote:

Originally posted by Chuck Melton:
Jack,

I have the "Euro" or extended parts book on my website, the one with the GR 3 features and parts, including the 10" wide Campys.

Chuck

Chuck. Can't find it. Can you provide a specific link?

Also. What is included in the Marti report for the Pantera? Does it show the original dealer?