----- Original Message -----
From: steven.liebenow@att.net
To: unlisted-recipients: ; no To-header on input
Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 11:25 AM
Subject: Goose Window motor replacement!


Greetings all!



My last post to you was regarding cracked frame bits etc. I must say that I got inconclusive info....other than the fact that the horizontal rear trans mount is fragile and susceptable to cracking! It is constructed of thin tin, folded over, slightly reinforced, and then welded up. I suspect that the original motor mounts allow the engine/trans assy. to flex and this results in cracks.... If you have adopted a more solid approach to motor mounts instead of the mushy factory (unobtainable??) ones, you probably will not have this problem, but it's good to look for it!



In Pantera International articles that I have recently reviewed, there were several articles interviewing guys that worked on the Goose's early on, when the Pantera was just being introduced, that eluded to having "chassis cracks" all over the place.....and some restoration articles that said the same..... however, none of you have responded back with anything of the sort! Strange! I think I did get one response that said one of the 4-link supports had a crack in it....



I think common sense rules here.... If you are pulling your engine out for detailing or for detailing the chassis, I think then you need to take a look at all of the 4-link mounts up in the forward area just behind the bulkhead. I would suspect that the welding quality could vary inmensly from car to car, side to side, etc. Another area to watch would be in the area of the shock mounts at the rear. Anywhere that a thin bracket is attached to the box frame should be looked at closely for indication of a problem. Ends of the support rods, where they attach at the bulkhead, and at the rear fender tops also.



A thin "redish" dusty line will indicate rust in a crack, an old crack! Use a little "mirror on a stick" to look behind stuff. Shiny lines indicating something moving against another part. I'm sure there are also other ways to find cracks as well, much more space age.



As for reinforcing these cars, it sounds like anywhere you look on a Goose, you could probably develope some sort of reinforcement for it...all depends on how wild you want to get.....and wether you are doing it yourself, or paying a guy at shop rates!



All in all, I don't believe that the cars are prone to any great damage when used for normal street driving. Anything more than this and you'd be wise to inspect and build to purpose!



Now, for my next issue/question.... I've got a guy that is working to change a pesky window motor. Not the regulator, just the motor itself. I believe that these were Dullcier (sp?) (French) motors, of a dual winding design, three wires, one fixed ground and two switched hots, one for up, one for down.



The replacement motors are two wire, meant for a switch that reverses polarity upon activation. These motors as is, will not directly plug into the system.



My question is this: I believe that an array of relays can be connected to allow a two wire motor to live in a three wire envireonment, by connecting the relays such that the ground and positives are switched properly so that there is no smoke...!!! Have any of you done this and would you happen to share a drawing of how this is accomplished with the relays?? (I could figure this out eventually, but am stuffed for time....and hoping that one of you have already been here!)



OR, if you've sourced out a three wire motor for this application please advise as well!



Please advise!



Had my Goose out this weekend for a short blast!!! Ooooh what a feeling!!! Need to get bigger squirrels for my AC fan though.....!!!! Anyone?



Take Care!
Steve



PS: There has been a guy (LA area) advertising Mangusta clutch slave cylinders on eBay as of late, for around $115 or so. These are the proper version for a Goose, but they are cast iron instead of the original aluminum. I think he's a tad high on the price, but that's just my opinion..... These are available from a Fiat dealer if you can find one with a large inventory. You will not find it at someone who only deals in 124 Spiders....as it was used on some very odd versions called a 2300 and a 1500 Osca. Part number 4039673.
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