Does anyone have pics of mind train slats? Particularly the underside attachments.
Thinking about getting a set made.
Cheers,
Janne
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I have a copy of the original brochure which shows all the individual pieces.
Picture of Jeff Burgy's car around 1980. These are the MindTrain. They mount with drilling a lot of holes into your deck on the ends of the slats.
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Picture of mine getting ready to send them to the powder coater.
Considerably more involved then the Mind train. These hinge like the 69-70 Mustang units and have more support.
They just mount in four places. Bottom just stick to the deck with double faced adhesive. Top mounts hidden under the top of the deck near the hinges.
Couple of thousand in labor to build these.
Polished stainless button head screws drilled and threaded into the supports like aircraft construction. Look like pop rivets without a closer look.
Weigh in at about 5 pounds total. .040 aluminum slats.
Considerably more involved then the Mind train. These hinge like the 69-70 Mustang units and have more support.
They just mount in four places. Bottom just stick to the deck with double faced adhesive. Top mounts hidden under the top of the deck near the hinges.
Couple of thousand in labor to build these.
Polished stainless button head screws drilled and threaded into the supports like aircraft construction. Look like pop rivets without a closer look.
Weigh in at about 5 pounds total. .040 aluminum slats.
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Images (1)
those really change the look of the car! WOW!
Yes. Much like the Lamborghini Miura.
quote:Originally posted by Husker:
I have a copy of the original brochure which shows all the individual pieces.
Have that in electronic format?
quote:Originally posted by PanteraDoug:
Picture of mine getting ready to send them to the powder coater.
Considerably more involved then the Mind train. These hinge like the 69-70 Mustang units and have more support.
They just mount in four places. Bottom just stick to the deck with double faced adhesive. Top mounts hidden under the top of the deck near the hinges.
Couple of thousand in labor to build these.
Polished stainless button head screws drilled and threaded into the supports like aircraft construction. Look like pop rivets without a closer look.
Weigh in at about 5 pounds total. .040 aluminum slats.
Are you in middle of building these or did you finish them already? Seems you made slightly wider slats than MT (10 vs.11)? Did you build the slats from individual pieces?
Yes, I didn't want to be accused of copying MindTrain. You never know who may be watching.
I cut my slats out of 4'x8' sheet of aluminum. That's normally how you buy it. I suppose you could get a supplier to cut them to width as you buy it, but no one in this area would do that.
I always liked the look of them from the time I saw them on Jeff Burgy's car way back.
These help shield the velocity stacks of the Weber cars from water, since two of them are out past the edge of the roof in the open.
One last check for fit on the decklid and they are off to get powder coated.
They need to be disassembled again for that to ship.
What's nice about the changes I made to the MindTrain concept is that you can handle mine in one assembly, like an aircraft wing.
I cut my slats out of 4'x8' sheet of aluminum. That's normally how you buy it. I suppose you could get a supplier to cut them to width as you buy it, but no one in this area would do that.
I always liked the look of them from the time I saw them on Jeff Burgy's car way back.
These help shield the velocity stacks of the Weber cars from water, since two of them are out past the edge of the roof in the open.
One last check for fit on the decklid and they are off to get powder coated.
They need to be disassembled again for that to ship.
What's nice about the changes I made to the MindTrain concept is that you can handle mine in one assembly, like an aircraft wing.
Do you mind sharing more detail how you made them, or do you plan to make them for sale at some point?
quote:Originally posted by jannem:
Do you mind sharing more detail how you made them, or do you plan to make them for sale at some point?
It's like asking the baker how to make the bread? First you kneed the dough, then you bake it. Simple.
No point in making them to sell. Too expensive. I wouldn't even buy them.
quote:Originally posted by PanteraDoug:quote:Originally posted by jannem:
Do you mind sharing more detail how you made them, or do you plan to make them for sale at some point?
It's like asking the baker how to make the bread? First you kneed the dough, then you bake it. Simple.
No point in making them to sell. Too expensive. I wouldn't even buy them.
Was it a poor choice of words from my part or generally stupid/offending question? English is not my first language and humor is sometimes difficult to translate as well.
It was a genuine question and I asked in order to learn. I've seen some guys find outright genius ways to solve mechanically relatively simple things.
You didn't offend me at all.
At this time I have no plans to sell them. I did think about it but it makes no sense to consider that seriously.
When the MindTrain was available, 25 to 30 years ago, they were about $300 to $400 for a set. Those that "are looking for a set" remember that or already know that.
There are several manufacturers on line that offer slats in that price range.
In order to make these slats for the Pantera, they need to be fit to decklid, piece by piece. The "stringers (which are the supports for them, like a staircase) need to be hand fabricated from aluminum and bolted together.
The slats themselves need to be cut out of a sheet of 4' x 8' aluminum.
Once constructed, and then fit, they need to be disassembled and sent to the powder coater.
There is no guaranty that every Pantera decklid will have the exact dimensions. In fact, I doubt that the '71 is exactly the same as the '74, and the '74 the same as the '84.
There is about one full week of labor for one "craftsman" to build these. Figure $1,800 in labor. Then there is the cost of the materials. Figure $400 to $450 for that. Then there is the cost of the powder coating which is $300.
So that comes to roughly $2,500. That's a long way from the original cost of the MindTrain slats and a long way from the on line prices you can find for a Mustang or plastic molded ones for a Camaro.
If you sell them, then how many sets will come back because the customer didn't like them? More then a couple.
How many sets are you going to sell? A couple.
How much can you charge? Cost is already around $2,500? The more you charge, the more complaints and dissatisfaction there will be with them. So sell them? Not much point?
Instruct on how to build them? Sure, I could, but that's an extensive explanation. One that would put someone else in business for one thing and I'm not the one that is going to teach the class and provide extensive dimensions, details, plans and videos of it for nothing. Most of which is more then basic mechanics.
I simply don't have that kind of time nor $10,000 to buy CAD software to draw the plans. This isn't NASA here and I don't have access to that type of "equipment" like some here do?
There are more then a few fabricators here on this forum. They really don't need my explanation. Just looking at them they will instantly know how to build them. Not to be sarcastic about it but some will go right past aluminum into titanium, maybe monel, or 10k gold (you need some material resilience, pure gold is too soft).
See. Just more fully answering that question is more extensive then it should be?
...and there is probably someone in China that is waiting for "simple" items like this to build that can build them better...for $150?
At this time I have no plans to sell them. I did think about it but it makes no sense to consider that seriously.
When the MindTrain was available, 25 to 30 years ago, they were about $300 to $400 for a set. Those that "are looking for a set" remember that or already know that.
There are several manufacturers on line that offer slats in that price range.
In order to make these slats for the Pantera, they need to be fit to decklid, piece by piece. The "stringers (which are the supports for them, like a staircase) need to be hand fabricated from aluminum and bolted together.
The slats themselves need to be cut out of a sheet of 4' x 8' aluminum.
Once constructed, and then fit, they need to be disassembled and sent to the powder coater.
There is no guaranty that every Pantera decklid will have the exact dimensions. In fact, I doubt that the '71 is exactly the same as the '74, and the '74 the same as the '84.
There is about one full week of labor for one "craftsman" to build these. Figure $1,800 in labor. Then there is the cost of the materials. Figure $400 to $450 for that. Then there is the cost of the powder coating which is $300.
So that comes to roughly $2,500. That's a long way from the original cost of the MindTrain slats and a long way from the on line prices you can find for a Mustang or plastic molded ones for a Camaro.
If you sell them, then how many sets will come back because the customer didn't like them? More then a couple.
How many sets are you going to sell? A couple.
How much can you charge? Cost is already around $2,500? The more you charge, the more complaints and dissatisfaction there will be with them. So sell them? Not much point?
Instruct on how to build them? Sure, I could, but that's an extensive explanation. One that would put someone else in business for one thing and I'm not the one that is going to teach the class and provide extensive dimensions, details, plans and videos of it for nothing. Most of which is more then basic mechanics.
I simply don't have that kind of time nor $10,000 to buy CAD software to draw the plans. This isn't NASA here and I don't have access to that type of "equipment" like some here do?
There are more then a few fabricators here on this forum. They really don't need my explanation. Just looking at them they will instantly know how to build them. Not to be sarcastic about it but some will go right past aluminum into titanium, maybe monel, or 10k gold (you need some material resilience, pure gold is too soft).
See. Just more fully answering that question is more extensive then it should be?
...and there is probably someone in China that is waiting for "simple" items like this to build that can build them better...for $150?
Nevermind. Thank you for your patience to respond.
-Janne
-Janne
Sure, no problem. Nice engine.
Don't know who sold these.
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I don't think he was asking for blueprints. Just some friendly advise on the difference in design between yours and the others.
The kind of stuff we all typically share to help each other.
The kind of stuff we all typically share to help each other.
quote:Originally posted by ZR1 Pantera:
I don't think he was asking for blueprints. Just some friendly advise on the difference in design between yours and the others.
The kind of stuff we all typically share to help each other.
I understand that and I explained the best I can without going into volumes and step by step instructions.
What do you do with your brake systems? Are you going to go step by step and write a book on it or just refer him to your brake page?
One can do a You Tube but even so, if one had that time and interest in doing one, are you going into detail how you select the size of the rotor, the offset, the type of brake compound, how to torque the bolt calipers, what brand to use and why, where to buy them, etc, etc, etc?
It's always difficult to drawn the line, even in a friendly way without the guy moving into the shop..."show me that again, one more time".
...show me how to put that Corevette engine in my Pantera, I've got five minutes!
quote:show me how to put that Corevette engine in my Pantera, I've got five minutes!
Anytime, just stop on by... You might be able to sell your louvers for $2500...
quote:Originally posted by ZR1 Pantera:
[QUOTE]show me how to put that Corevette engine in my Pantera, I've got five minutes!
Anytime, just stop on by... You might be able to sell your louvers for $2500...
[/QUOTEI don't want to sell them. They are getting buried with me. Just like the Egyptian Pharaohs had all those artifacts in their burial chamber.
".....I don't want to sell them. They are getting buried with me. Just like the Egyptian Pharaohs had all those artifacts in their burial chamber....."
With that flip up hinge design we can open 'em up and look down on you...
With that flip up hinge design we can open 'em up and look down on you...
quote:Originally posted by Rocky:
".....I don't want to sell them. They are getting buried with me. Just like the Egyptian Pharaohs had all those artifacts in their burial chamber....."
With that flip up hinge design we can open 'em up and look down on you...
I knew someone would understand.