Upgrade my brakes...

For some master brake info, see:
http://geocities.com/provamo72/
Tech info....Brak Master Upgrade.

Chuck

I converted to Porterfield r4s pads and it made a world of difference. Make sure you ask them to add on the tabs for the rear brakes or you ebrake doesn't work.

Jeff
6559

Mooso,

Jeff's endorsement of Porterfield pads is a very good point. Many have found great improvement with those pads. While brake upgrades are nice they may not be necessary for regular high demand street Panteras. If the money is there and isn't an issue, go for it. But do you know the stock system's history? Have you bled the system? Have you checked to see all caliper pistons are free to move in their bores? Is caliper thickness within specs? Have you upgraded from the old rubber caliper hoses to braided stainless steel? Are the vacuum booster hoses (front and rear) in good condition and well clamped? Are the stock proportioning valve and shuttle valve in place? If so, ae they functioning properly? While a full removal/upgrade should certainly fix braking issues, if not really needed, that money could go for lots of other projects. Just my 2 cents.

Larry

I couldn't agree more - go with the Porterfields! Do we have a consensus?

When I bought my car I added the Precision master/booster,braided lines and Porterfield pads front and back.The change was dramatic!
The cost was low well under $1000
I would highly recommend them.

The brakes in my '74 are STILL a little scary. I've rebuilt the stock front Girling calipers per the tech info gleaned from this forum and Jack's article in the POCA bulletin. Installed Porterfield R4S pads and put the stainless flex lines on all four corners. Mity-Vac'd the system (Speed Bleeders were out of stock at the time), AND had it pressure bled to 1200 psi. My pedal is better, but NOT confidence inspiring. I still have the stock proportioning valve. I have NO signs of leaks. Is my stock master bypassing? I've got to do the rears this winter and I'm thinking of springing for the $300 for a new 2-step Master like Chuck mentioned. You think this will fix it? By the way, what's the spec for the rotors?

I agree with "Teach Peace" before spending any money spend a weekend checking the each of the original components on the car; Remove each caliper and verify that each piston is free, flush the brake system and replace with fresh Dot 3~4 brake fluid, bleed the system at least twice or until you get a firm pedal and then perform some test in a safe manner. I had simular concerns with my high performance brakes on my Pantera and did the above and found that several of the pistons had frozen up in the calipers.

I've got a new master cylinder and I flushed the brakes and it stops very well now. Look on page 162 of your JEGS hot rod magazine, Christmas 2004, and you'll see how I'm doing the next upgrade to the braking system. Dynalite II 4 piston calipers, Polymatrix pads, two proportioning valves, front to rear bias and left to right rear brake bias,and JC Whitney has a catalog of tools, page 207 for the tools needed for redoing the hydraulics, which I had to order a few tools too, it's the 1/7/-1/11 issue. The rotors have to stay original for now. If the parts don't fit, I'll have to send them back. No restocking fees, I just lose freight cost. Reorder the right part and ask for free S&H. I'll see if I can stop 20% shorter distance at 60 mph. That's what I want. That's all I can tell you for now, except both merchants have online shopping with pictures and specs. I count on 6 to 8 weeks to get it done, a little at a time. I know I'll have a few more runs to the hardware store, the parts store, etc., but then the braking system will be 90 percent the way I want it, stopping wise.

VERYFAST: Which master brake cylinder did you use? In speaking with a few of the vendors, the bore size is dependent on whether you are using stock calipers or "upgraded" racing calipers (like the Dynalites). I was told 1" bore for stock and 1-1/8" for upgraded. The master I'm considering buying bolts to the stock booster with an adapter plate. All hardware is included. The flares are standard, so some new flaring needs to be done. I'm going to install a front/rear proportioning valve while I'm at it.

Actually, the new brake master cylinder was on the vehicle. It's been extensively serviced by Precision ProFormance in Orange County, CA, by the prior owner, a physician, who probably liked to keep his hands well groomed. I'm pretty sure it's their product. Saw it in a few ads in PI or POCA issues. Sturdy looking aluminum piece looks like it was machined out of aluminum billet. Bolts right on, no adapter, from a glance at it. I got a stack of receipts from prior owner from that vendor, I don't think they have a website, but if you review PI or POCA, you'll see, then they can mail you a very nice brochure with parts, pictures, but no pricing. (Trained by real estate agents??? POCA and PI issues are best resource.)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=4520883658&category=34199

My master didn't look like the one on this eBay site, but for $25 with several hours left to bid, maybe it's of interest to you. Mine is with a divider inside the reservoir, but looks like one reservoir from the outside. It's got a black metal cap that clips on that looks like it was from a Mustang of the same era. I could probably e-mail you in a week or so when I figure out my new digital camera.... I've seen it in the club mags. E-Bay's, that looks quite different, reservoirs look like plastic, and seperable from the hydraulic piston cylinder. I'll see if I can get the right ordering info in a day or two if you're really interested.

Nils, I just took a look at PIM's master cylinder, and mine looks just like it, from the picture. $169.99, minus member discount. A lot cheaper than body repairs to the front end when someone pulls out in front of you, not looking for such a short car passing down the road, like happened to me. Guy never even saw me. I guess I was lucky to have a car with these upgrades done already, but I want 20% better stopping for emergencies.
How do I edit these messages into one message?

I'm having trouble figuring out this posting business. If I could learn how to edit, I'd condolidate these messages. Nils, the master cylinder I have is very similar, if not exactly like the master cylinder at PIM, mine is aluminum, maybe theirs is painted. It's $169.99 and far better than inadequate brakes. A teenager pulled in front of me last Monday, he didn't look and I was going too fast. 0 to 5 mph in 35 yards or less, back wheel on right skidded silently never alerting him to look. Adrenaline for an hour, but no contact with this still unaware youngster. I want better brakes still for exactly those kind of situations. I'm going to get a local hydraulic lines maker to make stainless flex lines when my new calipers arrive. We don't need and expansion of any hydraulic lines anywhere. Oh yeah, PIM has rebuild kits for the master cylinder, and JC Whitney has SAE and Metric O-ring sets, so it's however you like doing it.

I definitely could have planned out this answer better about what master cylinder I have. It's not pictured in Hall's catalog, Precision ProFormance, it looks kind of like PIM's, it has some close looking counterparts in JEGS and Summit, but I can't find what it is.

What I made a mistake on is that it does have an adapter. The adapter is also machined aluminum, 3/4" or 20 mm thick. It has two side bolts on the m/c. It's machinded aluminum with numbers stamped on one side.

It looks like a bunch of selection for you, but it'll be a surprise if you get the exact same master cylinder I have. 10 to 15% chance at best. Probably you have ideas already, so maybe this helped, maybe not.

Hi VFI, After you complete your post, you will see a small icon at the bottom right that is a folder with a small eraser attached. You'll only see it on your posts, not others. If you click it, you will re-open your post and be able to edit it. Of course if you do that, you'll be so efficient that you'll be a Newbie forever!