Interior engine cover

@marlinjack posted:

...I have just contacted Flowkooler.

I told them I purchased well over 640 of their Thermostats...and One High Flow Water pump.

I Requesting they consider a Group Purchase for a Custom Machined 351 Cleveland water pump that has a 1.5" Shorter Hub Height. I.E. Standard Height of 5.7" Lowered to 4.2"

The Pulley Is Available on-line, Larger Bore? I can Machine a pressed-in Sleeve.

Stay Tuned

The exact height necessary is yet to be determined. It should be about 1.5" lower and the thought would be to make the final/fine adjustment with a custom pulley. That seems the simplest solution.

I wouldn't order or suggest an order of 150  pumps until the details are determined but it would be interesting to see if they were interested at all?

In that respect, good move.

The entire point of cutting the pump nose 1.5" would be to eliminate the final two small tiers around the pulley snout.

I just got a Duracast pump today to begin messing with that but at the moment I am very involved with my wifes medical conditions and can't dedicate my complete interest to this.

There is absolutely no doubt that it is the pump projection that motivated the original Detomaso design team to come up with a unique design solution that was completely ridiculous. Total horseshit to say the least.

Exactly what kind of a petty pissing match that existed between Ford and Detomaso to allow this we will never know but to me seems like a mutual suicide pact?

@marlinjack posted:

...We say 1.5" is good starting point, to clear the Firewall?...would 2.0" be Better?

Before I ever 'Ordered', I would take the Final Measurements.

We Both know the Pulley is going to be a Single Sheeve. 'Near' Flat with a Negative Off-Set.

If this is going to go any further, I'll take care of it.

MJ

P.S. Sorry to hear of your Wifes Condition.

I think that this is significantly beneficial subject to the Pantera community that should be kept going if possible.

Ultimately it fixes a major issue with the Pantera and in a really simple and economical way potentially making the car much more enjoyable to use.

All of your cautions on assembling and disassembling are noted. If I break the pump it will just be another notch in the gun handle of theoretically making me smarter.

I think what I laid out is the way to go. Mine works as is now but could be improved with the pump modification. Everyone or anyones input can just help finalize the details.

Of course it will probably require cold blooded courage to test under extreme conditions like driving through Death Valley in the heat of the summer?  I have no idea who we can find who is freakin' crazy enough to do that? Do you?

Yea, "wifey" is really going though one heck of a bumpy ride. All we can do is hang on but we will make it through. Thanks for the thought.

I was reading all the above and I was wondering why converting a electric water pump didn’t come up yet… they can’t turn crazy fast either I would think because of cavitation… or just use it as is..

the motor already sits in the dry.. Maybe needs a bearing plate…  just thinking out loud…

look.. slimline…

Any pump that needs around 1-1/2" less total height will work.

The electric pump wasn't discussed I would presume because none of us in the discussion have experience with it (as of yet).

I have no objection to discussing it but have no intention of going in that direction.

I'm not sure if increasing the flow to that extreme is adviseable without inadvertantly overstressing the Pantera's cooling design is the right direction and might be complicating things expotentially unnecessarily?

But "pump away" as you like.

Hey Doug – thanks for your good work on this project.

I’ve got this instructional manual, and its companion, “How to Run a Mill”. Let me know if I should send it along!

😎

Is that the text you used in tech instruction?

There are several threads in the archives on electric water pumps, mostly questions. Very few were actually installed and street driven. They just don't move enough water.

One now-deceased owner in So-Cal chapter installed one of the best electric pumps of the day (the type used with engine dynomometers for 5-minute runs) and made it all the way to 'Vegas and back for a Fun Rally. But this was a stone-stock Pantera that was driven conservatively, mostly in 5th gear. He had to cut the access door frame to fit.

I asked about his water temp and he admitted that it was 'around' 230F on the gauge the entire trip, and he was an excellent mechanic. He did not attend the Track Event. Can you say "ragged edge?" IMHO there's no way a modified engine or one driven as they were intended would have survived.

For anyone contemplating the pump modification, Dead Nuts on, has the parts that you need and the installation tool for the seal and all of the parts you might need?

They have nice instructions on how to install the impeller and seal as well.

Here is the link. Scroll down to find all the information in sub-links.

https://www.deadnutson.com/bos...water-pump-impeller/

Using the Boss 302 impeller is probably the best idea for a rotor.

"Seak and ye shall find".

There is already existing a Ford billet water pump pulley to use with the "Ford Racing 'short' water pumps".

https://www.cvfracing.com/shor...656&gad_source=1

It is too early to determine if this is the exact pulley offset to use once the nose of the pump is cut back, but the preliminary analyzation seems to indicate that it is?

@ Marlin: look at the countersunk bolt holes! Kool or what?

...That looks perfect!! And Will Work! The same 3/4" pilot bore that mates to the 351W 'Shorty' Pump! I'm going to start Documenting the Adaptation of the 302, 351 Winsor Shorty WP. I just purchased, along with the 'Flatter' 'Shorty' Pulley...Doug has now found.

I will be moving my posts to 'Pantera FLAT Firewall Documented and Photos', on this forum.

There...I will give my most recent measurements and show in photos, comparisons Between the Shorty Pump and the 'Flowcooler High-Flow' Pump, I have right in front of Me.

I am awaiting arrival for the 'Windsor Shorty' pump and pulley.

For the pros and cons of adaptation of the two, and My Solutions for Success...I will see You on the New Site! And,

I'll see You on the 'Highway of Broken Dreams'

you can save a couple of bucks here.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/121263279239