Over the next few weeks months the hard part of putting it all back together again, wish me luck, and thinks for the likes....
quote:What are your cam specs? Be sure to check your Scorpion roller rockers for clearance to the pushrod. Doug Braun on the DT Mail List had an issue with contact between the pushrod and rocker body (links below) and I had the same issue with my new engine. Given that you're using a Windsor, it may not be an issue. I believe the angles are a bit more extreme on the Cleveland, but my Scorpion Race Series roller rockers were spec'd to be capable of .950" of lift, and my cam is only .588" at max lift.
Details:
http://poca.com/pipermail/deto...December/048101.html
http://poca.com/pipermail/deto...December/048138.html
Just a follow-up on my own saga with the Scorpion roller rockers making contact with the pushrods. My rocker arms are silver, like yours, instead of anodized blue like all the Scorpion rockers seen on their website. According to the tech I've been dealing with, the silver rocker arms are an older version (possibly sitting on the shelf for a long time). The new ones are anodized blue and "have more clearance" on the rocker body to avoid contact with the pushrod. Be sure your engine builder checked the clearances there.
Nice work. Coming along great!
Lookin' very nice. Great color, is it chrome yellow?
Looks terrific. Good luck with the completion. All the time and work is about to be rewarded and enjoyed.
There are some pretty sweet rides in that shop, but I bet the car that gets the most close-up looks is yours. Great work!
Mark
Mark
nothing better then getting the engine back in the car..!
I agree - it's a great feeling of accomplishment when the motor gets back into the car.
It seems to me that you are on the downhill side of the project!
Congrats!
Rocky
It seems to me that you are on the downhill side of the project!
Congrats!
Rocky
anyone know where everything goes? 
lol its been so long apart.
lol its been so long apart.quote:anyone know where everything goes? lol its been so long apart.
I know the feeling. Mine had been apart for 6 years before getting it back on the road. I still have no idea where a gazillion little bolts and connectors went and those I could find were too grungy to put in my fresh new engine compartment, so lots of trips and $$$ to my local hardware store for new stainless hardware.
Unfortunately, the a broken valve spring and pushrod/rocker contact issue (mentioned in a prior post on this thread) resulted in the engine coming back out after only 987 miles. But, it should be back together in another month.
Hi Garth
I will be in CA for the next couple of weeks flying Monday...want a hand? You have my phone number. I have already texted Bob. Seeya
Joe
I will be in CA for the next couple of weeks flying Monday...want a hand? You have my phone number. I have already texted Bob. Seeya
Joe
Detonator
Looks great BTW great color
Looks great BTW great color
quote:Originally posted by JAG13CAT:
Looking good Detonator!
Question - I am in the early stages of restoration and was wondering what distributor (setup) you're using and if it will clear the bulhead?
Not going to fit without cutting/bending and then the window is a issue, so I am going with a MSD none HEI...
Looking good Detonator... nice progress. Hopefully all your bags of parts are labeled.. That should help w/ reassembly..... 
That should help w/ reassembly..... quote:Originally posted by Rob Borruso:
Looking good Detonator... nice progress. Hopefully all your bags of parts are labeled..
Yes some are, I did not take it apart so the bag thing yeah.... if it was me I would know where everything is, but lucky me I get a few box's of parts and a have fun lol
Detonator, My intention is not to rain on your parade, but be aware that your beautiful #1442 seems to have what's known by RBT Transmissions as a 'dash-1.5-series' ZF transaxle. This was an intermediate-stage ZF that uses the upside-down differential case needed for all Panteras, but due to parts shortages at ZF during the early days of Pantera production, an unknown number of early cars (mostly pushbuttons but obviously not all) got a Mangusta transmission bolted onto a special 4-bolt bellhousing (later used 6 bolts), and some also got the Mangusta ring & pinion gearsets. There are a myriad of parts inside that do not interchange with the 5DS-25/2 ZFs found in later cars, including the entire clutch, bellhousing and transmission mainshaft. Kirk Evans may have more specific info.
There's nothing really wrong with those transaxles- the gears were used in GT-40s, except that -1- if used, the gearsets are lower so acceleration is absurdly high (Goose ring/pinion ratio is 4.50:1 vs the Panteras 4.22:1 and overdrive 5th gear is 0.846 vs .705). This gave a top end at hydraulic-lifter-redline 5900 rpms of about 130 mph vs the later gearsets giving nearly 160 mph. This was also the source for some early magazine road-test disparities between various Panteras tested by "experts".
-2- Those four long tie-bolts & spacers between the bellhousing and ZF side-plates are notorious for loosening and eventually cracking the side plates, leading to a major lube-loss. Check the torques frequently! Some simply leave the bolts out.
-3- Spare parts for this combination from RBT are VERY scarce if something major goes wrong. Hundreds of such ZFs were scraped by Ford dealers at no charge to owners back in the '70s and other owners have purchased a later series spare to drive on, so what you have there is a virtual collector's item. I've seen maybe six others running in 33 years. Have your photos handy if you need to order parts for the ZF or clutch, and shift that big motor carefully....
There's nothing really wrong with those transaxles- the gears were used in GT-40s, except that -1- if used, the gearsets are lower so acceleration is absurdly high (Goose ring/pinion ratio is 4.50:1 vs the Panteras 4.22:1 and overdrive 5th gear is 0.846 vs .705). This gave a top end at hydraulic-lifter-redline 5900 rpms of about 130 mph vs the later gearsets giving nearly 160 mph. This was also the source for some early magazine road-test disparities between various Panteras tested by "experts".
-2- Those four long tie-bolts & spacers between the bellhousing and ZF side-plates are notorious for loosening and eventually cracking the side plates, leading to a major lube-loss. Check the torques frequently! Some simply leave the bolts out.
-3- Spare parts for this combination from RBT are VERY scarce if something major goes wrong. Hundreds of such ZFs were scraped by Ford dealers at no charge to owners back in the '70s and other owners have purchased a later series spare to drive on, so what you have there is a virtual collector's item. I've seen maybe six others running in 33 years. Have your photos handy if you need to order parts for the ZF or clutch, and shift that big motor carefully....
Bosswrench,
How do you detect the ZF specs. I ask b/c i have a Pb and numbers, tags all indicate it as a 3/71 but numbers on the ZF and Gbox ratio plate are 72 including case markings. I had mine redone to as new last may, not cheap and compared to my 73 Gts, it feels shorter in gearing with different and closer ratios. Still being broken in but surely a different feel.
How do you detect the ZF specs. I ask b/c i have a Pb and numbers, tags all indicate it as a 3/71 but numbers on the ZF and Gbox ratio plate are 72 including case markings. I had mine redone to as new last may, not cheap and compared to my 73 Gts, it feels shorter in gearing with different and closer ratios. Still being broken in but surely a different feel.
Interesting info Bosswrench, a lot of things on this car are for a lack of better words worth looking at, one piece window frames and some other odd parts, it's almost like detomaso needed to fill a order and had this sitting in the back, would make more sense if it was a push button. I know my dad had the trans rebuilt and wired back in the early 80s butfoy or however you spell it did the work.
I think your engine bay looks awesome.
Great work - I know what you are going through!
Rocky
Great work - I know what you are going through!
Rocky
I still have a lot of work to do, but it's getting very close to the finish, things left to do, hang exhaust, will involve cutting the flanges to line up, need to mock up a throttle cable bracket, find the overflow tank bracket in my boxes of parts lol, finish electrical, install ac condenser, tie and hang hoses and electrical wiring, bolt deck lid back on then back to BBR for suspension adjustments and final set up.
I figure still a few dozen things even after first drive to attend to but critical components will be done for Hot August Nights I hope...
I figure still a few dozen things even after first drive to attend to but critical components will be done for Hot August Nights I hope...
And thank you all for the kind words..
Detonator, looks great, fantastic work. You did insert that extender piece into the flywheel/crank that supports the shorter -1 ZF input shaft and is intended to hold the pilot bearing, right? It's really bad news if not (don't ask me how I know this), but could still be fixed now before you drive it, if not. It's the kind of thing easily forgotten the first time if changing engines and has been apart for a while as yours, and not a usual issue for most drivetrains.
Input shaft should be good yes extended PB my measurements with caliper have 1/4 of input shaft about what the wear marks on the input shaft, we should be good. Trying to mix 40 year old engineering with 2014 after market..
It runs! 
YAAAY!!!! Nice work your engine bay looks great. 
Congrats!
I wish I was in your shoes - just a couple more days (hopefully)!
I probably would have been done except for all the time I spend reading about everyone else's awesome cars!
Rocky
I wish I was in your shoes - just a couple more days (hopefully)!
I probably would have been done except for all the time I spend reading about everyone else's awesome cars!
Rocky
I still have lots of work sorting out electrical issues,headlight motor not working, power windows not working, if anyone has ideas what to look for I am all eyes n ears... also I plan to swap the ford Motorsport ignition module for a msd, interior needs putting back in, and then test drive.
also I plan to swap the ford Motorsport ignition module for a msd, interior needs putting back in, and then test drive.
Start with the fuses. If you have the stock fuse box they corrode quickly and everything stops.
I think 1755 is Right on. Upgrading the fuse panel is the first thing to do. It will solve problems you have and ghosts you don't even know about yet. It is a win win. That beauty deserves the best!!! Good Luck. It doesn't look like you need it but always nice to have.
quote:Originally posted by Detonator:
I still have lots of work sorting out electrical issues,headlight motor not working, power windows not working, if anyone has ideas what to look for I am all eyes n ears...
The MSD will just complicate your life needlessly. Put in a Pantera-Electronics unit as well as his fuse panel.
www.Pantera-electronics.com.
The best distributor to use is going to be a Ford solid state unit. No one is going to see an MSD billet distributor in this car.
Looks to me like I have some grounding issues, as for the msd, I like msd so that's what I am doing, thanks for the ideas though.
Hey Detonator, congrats on the milestone. Got any vid of it running? BTW, your engine/engine bay look fantastic.
Hey to your earlier remark about your car being built with odds/ends laying around the DeTomaso plant. I've read that there were many cases a chassis would get pushed to the side for whatever reason for rework, and then later re-introduced into prodcution. I would imagine this is what happened to yours...hence early chassis elements. If they could only talk....
Hey to your earlier remark about your car being built with odds/ends laying around the DeTomaso plant. I've read that there were many cases a chassis would get pushed to the side for whatever reason for rework, and then later re-introduced into prodcution. I would imagine this is what happened to yours...hence early chassis elements. If they could only talk....
quote:Originally posted by Rob Borruso:
Hey Detonator, congrats on the milestone. Got any vid of it running? BTW, your engine/engine bay look fantastic.
Hey to your earlier remark about your car being built with odds/ends laying around the DeTomaso plant. I've read that there were many cases a chassis would get pushed to the side for whatever reason for rework, and then later re-introduced into prodcution. I would imagine this is what happened to yours...hence early chassis elements. If they could only talk....
I do have a video http://youtu.be/54daxOfJRoQ