Never figured I was particularly weak legged, and I know I can't compare it to a modern clutch, but the clutch in 2811 is rather hard to depress and hold down. I don't know enough to know whether that's normal or not. Seller says this clutch is one of the easier ones. (Centerforce dual friction clutch, Rebuilt clutch master and new clutch slave) Thoughts?
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Generally speaking, yes, not a Toyota 4-runner or other minimally actuated deal. Not knowing what your previous owner did you might consider bleeding the system and put in new fluid as a start and see from there how you like it before jumping into force reduction kits and the like.
I second PanteraPatt. Fill and bleed can go a long way on a hydraulic clutch. And if the car sits a lot, go out there and pump it with your foot a few times to keep things moving. Mine usually feels like garbage until I give it a few pumps.
Thanks you both, excellent advice again...
They make a clutch effort reduction kit for these cars. It came on the later cars but mine #3239 was too early to have it.
I had never experienced a clutch as heavy as the Pantera even after upgrading to the Centerforce clutch. I got mine from Larry over at Pantera Parts Connection and although it wasn’t cheap or easy to install because the pedal box is sooo tiny on our cars, it made a huge difference in how it feels to drive my Pantera.
The clutch is still super hard compared to other cars but it is dealable Without the kit, my car was almost impossible to operate
Search the site for clutch effort reduction kit and you will see several posts and pictures of the bell crank and rods that make up the kit.
Feel free to PM me with any questions
Thanks Paul. I am reluctant to do too much big mechanical work on this now. I'm still on thin ice with the Mrs! But as I drive it more and more I'll zero in on what makes sense first. The clutch is a big deal, but you and others have confirmed that it's not just me...
Make sure everything is working properly, so you can rule out a maintenance issue. The clutch effort reduction kit helps quite a bit and the latest aftermarket ones are better than OEM. You might want to stick your head under the dash to see if you already have it. A hydraulic T/O bearing helps a lot too but it has drawbacks when it comes to serviceability. Once you get it installed and set up, it should be trouble free for years but getting there can be a chore.
……Once you get it installed and set up, it should be trouble free for years but getting there can be a chore…….
been there, done that, too many times in the last 20 years
Thanks David and Larry. As someone who is "mechanically challenged" I usually rely on professionals for things like this. If I do it, it will require 87 new tools, take months, maybe years, and cost hundreds of innocent lives.
back before "old timers" started taken its toll, here is my effort to put numbers to clutch pedal force.
I seem to recall SAE's standard recomendations were considerable less than what the Pantera requires, even with the toggle linkage
That is amazing! Now, can you calculate my financial burn rate after buying this car? I have so much I want to do...getting it detailed today...
Individual clutch sets can vary in their feel. I've worked on Panteras that my enthusiastic 5'3" wife refused to drive due to a too stiff clutch, and I've had others with clutches you could push in with your hand. None, by the way, slipped in street driving. Any clutch titled 'heavy-duty' will likely be too stiff for the street. One common problem is, non-Pantera parts vendors see "Pantera" and instantly think "race car". This is particularly true if the car was built before the effort reduction kit, or the never-lubricated steel-on-steel parts in your kit are badly galled/worn, or the hydraulic slave system is mis-adjusted or leaking.
Proper adjustment of the clutch linkage is very important as well. Too much pre-load will work against you and the car, and too loose will cause rapid wear on the ZF transaxle synchros- you do NOT want to check on the cost of a ZF overhaul today! With all-new, lubricated parts in the entire clutch system, there's only about 0.040" of clearance between the flywheel & clutch disc, with the clutch pedal matted hard! And that tiny space is split between the flywheel-to-disc, and disc-to-clutch surfaces. You check this by having someone push the pedal firmly to the floor while someone else reaches in thru the clutch inspection/ventilation hole in the bellhousing with a long flat-blade feeler gauge.
Thanks Boss, sounds complicated for a mechanically challenged guy like me...I 'm waiting on my registration to come in, so I can't drive it around and work with it. Soon enough though...
Being 'mechanically challenged' works against you in the case of the Pantera, but asking questions and being cautious makes up for some of it. If you have the spare time, free night classes in welding, mechanics and electrics are always available even if you still don't do much of your own work. I once bought one of my friends (a VP of Hewlett-Packard a Mechanics Handbook for Christmas, after he told me of some of the people he was doing business with, keeping his several cars in good shape. I told him I knew he could afford to not do his own work, but I wanted him to at least recognize when he was being royally hosed.
Incidentally, one of your new friends in the 'Vegas area is or should be Eugene Sadoian (AKA "Clean Gene"). He also has a modified yellow pre-L and would likely be a good local resource (702-362- 2405). He's had his since '75 I think.
Yeah, I know. A car like this needs an owner who can wrench. That's not me. But I know enough to NOT try and do something I can't. Thankfully, I have good friends, and am making new ones everyday here in LV. I'll check in with Gene, would love to have some local allies.
Brian, just because you have never “wrenched” before doesn’t mean you can’t start. You might enjoy it! The Pantera’s easy to work on too. Just go slow and ask questions here, if you aren’t sure about something.
Thanks for the encouragement David, I plan on it, I mean the asking questions part...
Find a competent local, independent mechanic. The Pantera is just a Ford. Ownership doesn't mean you have to work on it.
Thanks again Pat. I just moved here, so my contacts are still developing. I had a great mechanic in my previous home.
I am about to install the effort reduction kit in 1611. I already did my car 1362. One thing I noticed more than less effort was better clutch disenguagment. It increases the stroke as well as changes the point of effort. The extra disenguagmet has to help the ZF last longer and You do noy have to bottom out the pedal to grab a gear!
Thanks lastpush, please update the thread about how that goes. What effort reduction kit did you get? Can you post a link?
Here is another link to effort reduction discussion from the past. https://pantera.infopop.cc/top...eduction-linkage-kit
Precision ProFormance has been closed for several years since the passing of Bobby.