Slow water drip

Yes, I second the motion and appreciate Marlin's guidance !!!

I had a problem with a water leak on the driver side cylinder head.  My symptom was steam blowing out of the exhaust.  The cylinder head surface was perfect and despite trying several time to replace the head gasket the problem only got worse.  I finally began to focus on the block and noticed a slight rust bubble around a water passage and used my large sanding block to carefully flatten it.  The sanding block is a glass shelf with sandpaper glued to it.  

I talked to the mechanic that is doing my engine work and the new gasket will not be copper. He said the block has a bore of 4.030 and will be using Felpro head gasket..
What is the sign 3M?


Dave

@goodwinpantera posted:

..
What is the sign 3M?


Dave

Huh?????

Larry

3M is a brand name of a manufacturer…

3M typically makes adhesives and abrasives, so perhaps someone brought it up as a sealant or a gasket compound?

My guess is somebody mentioned it in one of the earlier versions of this thread (which I thought were amusing, albeit a little unnecessarily heated) or in the linked thread, above.

3M really stands for “Minnesota Mining and Manufacturing”.

EDIT:  See the next post!  John nailed it!

It appears in the above pic of Steve's sanding block.  It is the manufacturer of the sanding sheet that is glued to his glass shelf.

John

...Doug is Right! Copper Gaskets Require a Higher Torquing to 'Crush' the Copper, Period. You can get this with a Stud kit...remember 40% Higher Clamping Force!!

As far as the Manifold End Seals, I do Not Use the 'Red' Permatex gasket maker, It is Too 'Grainy'. I use the Permatex 'Black Ultra'. The way I do it is...Squeeze a 1/4" Thick Bead of Silicone on BOTH surfaces of the Head AND Manifold, don't forget the Corners and the Major Gaskets go on First, Over the (4) Studs. Then Drop the Manifold Down while the Sealant is Pliable, Not Even Taky, this Guarantees the sealant will be Squeezed into Every Void, Plus the Sealant will also 'Stick' to the Manifold, for a more Perfect Seal!

...I see the Aussie drops the Manifold on, THEN installs 4 'Guide Bolts' Finger Loose, does a Little Shimmy on the Manifold, and then Starts Torquing 2 bolts on the one Side Only, No Torquing Sequence? Is This Serious??

Last in My view, the Red 'Mountain' of gasket maker is So THICK, he will have to really Torque on Those 'Aluminum' Manifold Bolts, to come close to compressing that mound down for the manifold to be in Alignment! And The sealant will Not be 'Adhered' to the Manifold Itself! It is Sure to Blow-Out. It's Not Very Smooth where it counts, and Grainy. FWIW

MJ

Yes. The silicone varies. The red has problems, the black is the best and less sensitive to contaminants on the sealing surfaces but  I've had good luck with the simple blue as long as you wipe everything down with alchohal to get everything clean. It has to be completely dry also or you will find places when you strip it down that it didn't stick.

The black as it cures actually pulls the pieces together.

As far as the guidance studs go, I find using four is to many for me and one on each side is enough.

That isn't a new idea though. If you have worked on Ford small block 289 series engines (260-302) you will find that when using the iron intake manifolds, the factory has used studs on those four positions since the early '60s.

I'm sure that Marlin is right on that, laying down the intake, especially a heavy one like the iron intake, you get much better results if you drop it on the exact correct spot to begin with without having to wiggle it around to align the bolts.

How about just using good gaskets and installing them properly?  I try my best to use a minimum of silicone. Excess squeeze out on the outside looks sloppy and  I don't like to imagine the possible issues with squeeze out on the inside getting loose.

This installation has got eleven years and over ten thousand miles on it and hasn't leaked a drop.

I do re-torque/check my engine fasteners each season. Rocker cover bolts, oil pan and carb bowl screws always seem to take up a little, manifold hardware not so much after the first few times. Head bolts and internals I do not touch.

We are going to replace head gasket with Felpro brand and use the Right Stuff to seal the intake china walls.


Dave

One small addition to the foregoing from a chemist: there are several types of silicone and they don't all cure the same. I won't get into the chemistry, but common hardware-store RTV cures by exhuding acetic anhydride, which instantly reacts with atmospheric moisture to form acetic acid and gives off the familiar vinegar odor. This type should NOT be used against bare metal, as the acid will begin corroding steel and you'll get the equivalent of "rust" . If  your RTV smells like vinegar, do NOT use it on windshields!

In the last half of the 20th century, professional auto glass people specified a type of RTV that cures by exhuding acet-aldehyde which is a light gas that vanishes without further reacting. It has NO odor while curing. THIS is the type of RTV commonly used on windshields at pro glass shops, and is available in tubes at windshield shops everywhere. But not at Home Depot for caulking guns! I have seen non-leaking Panteras with windshield channels so corroded by the wrong silicone, they were no longer structurally sound!

In case you are wavering on using the cork in the kits or silicone, as supplied, the cork is either too thick or too dry.

When you see how pliable and compressible the cork is supposed to be v. how you get it, you can begin to understand the issue.

You need to compress that 1/4" thick cork down to less then 1/8".

Ford ALUMINUM intake manifolds do have the WELL DESERVED reputation of being fragile on the outermost bolt flanges OFTEN breaking them completely off while attempting to tighten down those bolts while using the cork gaskets.

True the factory used them with little issue but they were very soft and pliable under those conditions.

The black rubber ones sometimes supplied in Cleveland kits are more pliable but literally need to be glued in place before you set the manifold.

By far the simplest solution is to use the proper silicone.