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quote:
Originally posted by 1Rocketship:
Posting a car for sale & subsequently attaching a video & Encouraging parties to ..."Check out the video!", is going to illicit comments, both positive & critical.

As far as criticism being in your opinion the causation of ... "People wonder why Pantera's don't go up as much in value as other classics, well I would postulate it is in pa, highlighting every fault rather than focusing on the individuality and positive".

Nothing could be further from the truth, for an example.

The Ferrari Dino was belittled & criticised for decades as being the step child Ferrari & comments about the underpowered 6 cylinder engine, build quality, etc,etc.

Ferrari Dino's now are $400,000.00+++ cars.

The Plymouth Superbird & Dodge Daytona Charger are 2 more examples. Both cars languished on showroom floors, being shunned by the public at large, now trading depending on options up to $500,000.000+++

The 1963 "Split Window" Corvette was criticised for the "Split" & poor driver's visibility & many owners actually cut away the "Split", now those are $100,000.00 cars.

The Lamborghini Countach called a "Space Ship", an "Alien Car", Undrivable, etc,etc,...now the "alien" has landed in the $600,000.000 price Planet.

A more recent example, the Ford GT, another car that received a HUGE amount of negative comments, criticisms & collecting dust on showroom/s floors, ONCE AGAIN those Ford GT's selling NOW for 2+++ TIMES the original MSRP.

I could add additional countless examples, my point/s being Soundly affirmed!

So obviously your observation/s in regards to public criticism being the bane of a cars/Pantera's appreciation has not a single iodium of merit/truth.


In FACT many on this forum as evidenced by their collective numerous posts are in FACT, quite pleased by their Panteras appreciation in value.

I would suggest if you want to own a car that draws no negative criticism, then move to an uninhabited planet, just make sure it's not Mars, as I wouldn't want a Martian complaining about your rim choice & causing your angst...Mark


There has NEVER been a car produced that was devoid of criticism...Mark


Talking of planets I don't know on which one posting a video and saying "check it out" reads as "Watch the video and belittle and beride my car in public please".

You make a very valid point (with countless examples) on values of some cars that were not regarded well by collectors for many years. Yes those cars have all overcome that hurdle in what is now a strong collector car market, however Pantera values have not risen to the same occasion. It would be good to see some statistics on comparative price increases over time and I bet the gap widens, Pantera's IMO are still undervalued.

Once again you choose to blow an observation out of proportion, yes there will be critics of every car. I have no issue with people telling me they would have done my cars differently, that is personal taste. What is not tasteful is airing that publicly to a sellers post, if you are in the market and don't like that particular example simply move on or figure your required modifications cost into your negotiation with the seller. The fact is a lot of the people who comment aren't even in the market they just want to knock someone elses vision, that is not what Pantera ownership used to be about. Maybe I'm getting too old and the demographics are changing, that is what happens when the cars remain cheap and any punk can buy one.

Julian
quote:
Originally posted by 1Rocketship:
quote:
Originally posted by 1973 Pantera:
quote:
Originally posted by Joules:
It strikes me that more often than not whan a car comes up for sale here there are people willing to jump all over it and find fault.

IMO the "Pantera's for sale" section should be exactly that, a means for forum members to post their car for sale with legitimate responses and requests for more information and contact etc.

It should not be a bunch of virtual tire kickers who have not seen or inspected the car first hand.

Julian
Flame suit on



AMEN Julian.

Thankfully it's not as frequent on this forum as some others I been on, but I agree that negative comments or observations should not be posted in response to someones ad.

If one is genuinely interested or concerned, the seller should be contacted directly with a Private Message.
Why are some members so adverse to criticism?!

Criticism can be used as a valuable tool to fix/correct errors/problems & as a result produce a better product for sale.

Did you even watch the video?!...There is a fuel line from the fuel cell precariously close/lying on top of the positive terminal of the battery!!! ( 7:59 of video)

Do you feel that hazardous situation should not be commented on???!!!

I wonder what environment those people that so vehemently fear criticism work in, obviously not the real world!...Mark


So a Private Message to the seller, the one person on the planet who could immediately correct any problems, isn't sufficient?

Especially when your "observation" is totally WRONG?

Look closer: the fuel line at 7:59 of the video is lying close to the NEGATIVE terminal, not the positive. The cable is red, but it is actually the ground cable.

The positive battery terminal, which is well away from the fuel line, is well covered/protected by a red plastic cover. You can clearly see the positive cable exiting down thru the chassis from the positive terminal.

Oops! Razzer

As for your ponder: "I wonder what environment those people that so vehemently fear criticism work in, obviously not the real world!"

I have been a Commercial Pilot for 24 years. In my world accuracy is everything.

I guess it's not in yours................. Wink Big Grin
Last edited by 1973pantera
quote:
Originally posted by Joules:
quote:
Originally posted by 1Rocketship:
Posting a car for sale & subsequently attaching a video & Encouraging parties to ..."Check out the video!", is going to illicit comments, both positive & critical.

As far as criticism being in your opinion the causation of ... "People wonder why Pantera's don't go up as much in value as other classics, well I would postulate it is in pa, highlighting every fault rather than focusing on the individuality and positive".

Nothing could be further from the truth, for an example.

The Ferrari Dino was belittled & criticised for decades as being the step child Ferrari & comments about the underpowered 6 cylinder engine, build quality, etc,etc.

Ferrari Dino's now are $400,000.00+++ cars.

The Plymouth Superbird & Dodge Daytona Charger are 2 more examples. Both cars languished on showroom floors, being shunned by the public at large, now trading depending on options up to $500,000.000+++

The 1963 "Split Window" Corvette was criticised for the "Split" & poor driver's visibility & many owners actually cut away the "Split", now those are $100,000.00 cars.

The Lamborghini Countach called a "Space Ship", an "Alien Car", Undrivable, etc,etc,...now the "alien" has landed in the $600,000.000 price Planet.

A more recent example, the Ford GT, another car that received a HUGE amount of negative comments, criticisms & collecting dust on showroom/s floors, ONCE AGAIN those Ford GT's selling NOW for 2+++ TIMES the original MSRP.

I could add additional countless examples, my point/s being Soundly affirmed!

So obviously your observation/s in regards to public criticism being the bane of a cars/Pantera's appreciation has not a single iodium of merit/truth.


In FACT many on this forum as evidenced by their collective numerous posts are in FACT, quite pleased by their Panteras appreciation in value.

I would suggest if you want to own a car that draws no negative criticism, then move to an uninhabited planet, just make sure it's not Mars, as I wouldn't want a Martian complaining about your rim choice & causing your angst...Mark


There has NEVER been a car produced that was devoid of criticism...Mark


Talking of planets I don't know on which one posting a video and saying "check it out" reads as "Watch the video and belittle and beride my car in public please".

You make a very valid point (with countless examples) on values of some cars that were not regarded well by collectors for many years. Yes those cars have all overcome that hurdle in what is now a strong collector car market, however Pantera values have not risen to the same occasion. It would be good to see some statistics on comparative price increases over time and I bet the gap widens, Pantera's IMO are still undervalued.

Once again you choose to blow an observation out of proportion, yes there will be critics of every car. I have no issue with people telling me they would have done my cars differently, that is personal taste. What is not tasteful is airing that publicly to a sellers post, if you are in the market and don't like that particular example simply move on or figure your required modifications cost into your negotiation with the seller. The fact is a lot of the people who comment aren't even in the market they just want to knock someone elses vision, that is not what Pantera ownership used to be about. Maybe I'm getting too old and the demographics are changing, that is what happens when the cars remain cheap and any punk can buy one.

Julian
WOW!!!..didn't realize that potential Pantera buyers were viewed in your very disparaging commentary as "Punks"!!!..."that is what happens when the cars remain cheap and any punk can buy one".

Glad I bought mine 20 years ago when buyers were considered "Astute Collectors".

Rather hypocritical to chastise people for making criticisms of a Pantera, yet you feel absolutely NO need to rein in your criticisms about "Punk Buyers".

That is what is referred to as "Selective Indignation"...Mark
quote:
Originally posted by 1973 Pantera:
quote:
Originally posted by 1Rocketship:
quote:
Originally posted by 1973 Pantera:
quote:
Originally posted by Joules:
It strikes me that more often than not whan a car comes up for sale here there are people willing to jump all over it and find fault.

IMO the "Pantera's for sale" section should be exactly that, a means for forum members to post their car for sale with legitimate responses and requests for more information and contact etc.

It should not be a bunch of virtual tire kickers who have not seen or inspected the car first hand.

Julian
Flame suit on



AMEN Julian.

Thankfully it's not as frequent on this forum as some others I been on, but I agree that negative comments or observations should not be posted in response to someones ad.

If one is genuinely interested or concerned, the seller should be contacted directly with a Private Message.
Why are some members so adverse to criticism?!

Criticism can be used as a valuable tool to fix/correct errors/problems & as a result produce a better product for sale.

Did you even watch the video?!...There is a fuel line from the fuel cell precariously close/lying on top of the positive terminal of the battery!!! ( 7:59 of video)

Do you feel that hazardous situation should not be commented on???!!!

I wonder what environment those people that so vehemently fear criticism work in, obviously not the real world!...Mark


So a Private Message to the seller, the one person on the planet who could immediately correct any problems, isn't sufficient?

Especially when your "observation" is totally WRONG?

Look closer: the fuel line at 7:59 of the video is lying close to the NEGATIVE terminal, not the positive. The cable is red, but it is actually the ground cable.

The positive battery terminal, which is well away from the fuel line, is well covered/protected by a red plastic cover. You can clearly see the positive cable exiting down thru the chassis from the positive terminal.

Oops! Razzer

As for your ponder: "I wonder what environment those people that so vehemently fear criticism work in, obviously not the real world!"

I have been a Commercial Pilot for 24 years. In my world accuracy is everything.

I guess it's not in yours................. Wink Big Grin
One quality I possess is the ability to admit "I'm Wrong" & in this case, you are exactly correct in regards to the fuel line from the fuel cell being on top of the ground cable, as I was fooled ( My Error) by the RED terminal on top of a ground cable.

See how easy it is for myself to accept criticism & admit fault.

Lesson to be learned here for some readers of this & other threads!...Mark

This is the car I bought in July of 21. Thought it was a driver and turned into a 2 year project..



the compression ratio was closer to 11:1 and the motor lasted all of 50 miles, she was a screamer though, built on a 2 bolt main block. Leaked oil out of the rear main seal? The fuel cell was leaking and the seller out of Florida knew it and didn't disclose it.

sure is pretty in my garage

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