HI ALL AND HAPPY NEW YEAR.
I am wondering what the general concensus is as far as PANTERA PRICE'S. With the current trend of so many car's being sold out of the
UNITED STATES [due to the weak dollar] and being shipped oversea's or generally exported
out of the U.S. to new owner's HOW [if at all]
will it affect the pricing of our car's?
My personal thought's are: If the current trend continue's we will see the price's going up to
a point where they are still attractive to [foreign] out of U.S. buyer's while at the same time making them less attractive / and more out of reach for the would be U.S. buyer's.
What's your opinion's???
JOHN.
Original Post
I think the Pantera is more of a bargain than ever. The prices have only gone up very slightly and the US dollar has dropped much more. Personally, I think the whole collector car market is due for another major melt-down, but Panteras haven't gone stupid like so much Detroit iron, so I don't expect any big drop in prices for us. As you observe, the big money now is in Europe and Asia, not here.
MARK I agree with you, however i hope that the DETROIT IRON doesn't melt down to soon as i have a 69 "R" code MACH 1 i will be looking to sell in the spring. It should be VERY interesting to see what kind of price's the BARRETT JACKSON auction bring's this year!
quote:
Originally posted by Mark Charlton:
Personally, I think the whole collector car market is due for another major melt-down, but Panteras haven't gone stupid like so much Detroit iron, so I don't expect any big drop in prices for us.


I agree, there is some "dark clouds" in the collector car market.

Buying a classic car only for investment reasons, is the wrong reason for me. I guess the most of us on the forum bought a Pantera because we wanted one (badly..) - not only as a investment.
I think Pantera prices will go through the roof, but mainly because the dollr will be worthless. You will see 125,000 dollar Panteras but $45,000 Honda Accords. Panteras will be about 10,000 euros and guys over there will buy them as parts cars. Meanwhile over here we will be ridding bicycles to work at walmart.
Detom, HI. You are certainly an optimist aren't you? [Just kidding] But seriously yes the dollar is taking a beating, which bring's up another question....
What is the general concensus as to why the dollar is so weak? Yes inflation and especially the price of fossil fuel [in the form of gasoline price's / home heating oil price's and of course all the add on surcharge's from the various companie's [re] the electric company
etc] My 2 cent's worth [i don't mean to sound like a hater but!] is that a lot of the problem's can be attributed to the MILLION'S of illegal's working off the book's for cash money
while the [greedy] companie's that employ them reap all the benefit's of their labor and not having to pay any taxe's / medical or any other type of insurance for them [who pay's for this when they need medical help etc??
YOU AND ME THAT'S WHO.
Add the fact that a very large percentage of these illegal's are sending MOST of their earning's out of the country, thereby draining money from our economy because the government has to print more money to replace that money which in turn make's it worth that much less.
SORRY for the rant, but it is what it is?
ANY OTHER OPINION'S?
With Italian style, high performance American muscle reliability, and rarity you would think means more value down the road. As long as the style spells "wow exotic", then I think prices will be high. It also depends on right place at the right time, right person. This is all just crystal ball stuff...I recall in high school my hillbilly upstate NY buddies driving around drunk and crashing into things with their Hemi Cudas, and driving on the salty snowy roads (if they only knew then what we know now). In my opinion advertising our cars doesn't do much either, but drive it around, and you see people drule and money talk comes pouring out. I think when people see our cars in person it blows their minds and the myths and bad rap goes out the window. I would think cars that are 100% stock and those that are on the other extreme of highly modified well built cars will bring the money...lets face it, some day we will all need nursing home money Frowner, I look forward to having Bambi looking after me Smiler

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DELOREANS, HI. If indeed BARRETT JACKSON has fewer car's on auction this year, personally I think that is due to their [accepting only car's with NO RESERVE] policy. With the economy the way it is and the price's being what they are [off] it would be very easy for seller's
to get "screwed" ESPECIALLY if they got a less than desireable time slot for the sale. Maybe the seller's are wising up to the
'no reserve policy".
JOHN
In the short run, regardless of what the rest of the market does, the Panteras will keep rising.

They are drastically "undervalued" compared to just about everything else.

Cars are going overseas becasue of that and the dollar valuation. I'm not a believer in cheap dollars. It doesn't help me with anything that I want.

As far as the world economy, the US is going to be more stable then most other places. Mainland China is the wildcard because of the size of the population and what even meeger gains do to the rest of the world.
The major threat to the dollar is what oil is traded in. If more and more countries trade it in Euros then a Mexican Peso will eventually be worth more.

Keep in mind that the only people that will complain that a Pantera costs $150,000 for a driver are the people who don't have one. I think the people that stuffed 454 Chevies in and cut the roofs off to fit their surf boards in, will also be unhappy.

Just my 1.5 cents worth.

Wow! I made that many posts? I should get a life!
People are unsure/afraid of things they don't know about. Very few people know about Panteras.
They have a bad reputation. Electrical, cooling, RUST....They are looked down upon by most purebread Italian marques. They are ignored by the Detroit iron crown because they're Italian. They are the bastard children of the car world.
It will be tough for our cars to rise in value because you can now buy a low mileage Viper or Z06 for $30k. Our beautiful cats cannot compete with modern technology.
I don't care though. If the value was that of Hemi-Cuda, then I wouldn't have been able to buy one (actually 2).
My 2 cents
In the 30 plus years I've owned a Pantera, Pantera owners have always claimed the cars are way underpriced. Then when the price starts to go up, they complain that they are getting too expensive for us "average Joe" owners.

IMHO, it would be nice to see some appreciation; it would help justify some of the cost of restoring the cars which, in turn, would help keep our vendors going, etc.

The truth for me, and probably for most of us, is that I love the car in spite of, and because of, its faults. I don't want a Z06 or a Viper. In real dollars, my car is probably only worth, today, about as much as I paid for it way back when. This means all the money I've spent restoring/maintaining/insuring the car is an unrecovered cost. But I don't care, I plan to keep driving mine for as long as it takes for prices to go up.
I'm with you, Jeff. I would have to keep my car for another 100 yrs to see its price rise to match what I've invested in it. But fortunately I didn't do it for the money.

As for Vipers and Z06s, they're nice reliable performance cars and are great fun to drive. But they don't come close to the Pantera. Neither does anything else.

Like a friend of mine said while scanning all the Ferraris and Lambos at Monterrey "...they look like a box of Smarties spilled out in the grass - all exactly the same, just in different colors."
""As for Vipers and Z06s, they're nice reliable performance cars and are great fun to drive. But they don't come close to the Pantera. Neither does anything else""

I agree with you guys. I love my Pantera, but the original question relates to why our cars have not gone up like other cars. Most people (that don't own a Pantera) don't feel the same way as us. That's why they they go out and buy the Vipers and Vettes for much less money, IMHO.
The largest contributing factor to the value of the cars over time is a very active, visual club like SAAC.
It is harder to do with basically only a couple of models but things like this forum help.

If you think about the Vegas run then you know that there is solid support for at least the Pantera and the Mangusta.

Publicity at a national level helps a lot. Car values are like currency values in that they are only backed by consumer confidence.

The greater of the illusion that there is something there the better.

There really isn't anything on the right coast to come close to Vegas. The Pocono event doesn't get much press.

The solution is just a lot of little things over time and there is no way to add race history to the marque.

Detomaso should have been nicer to Henry way back. After all if you look at it, it has been Fords money all along that sponsered the successes in the Ford family.
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