I bought a stroker 393 without a intake and we had to take .003 of the intake flanges. Ran it up on the test stand and found a small drip of water coming out between lower corner of intake and head. Oil is clear no milkshake. Did he not use enough RTV sealant on the intake. Not running the valley pan.
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Is your motor a Cleveland or a Windsor?
Larry
It is a Cleveland engine. the drip was from the back of the engine.
A little more RTV in that area plus more care in installing the intake. They can also suck oil from the block valley into an intake port if you're careless, or use steel shim intake gaskets or the so-called 'turkey-roaster'. I personally ALWAYS use composite intake gaskets and a thick bead of silicone without the stock cork 'china-wall' end gaskets at all.
Good to hear. We will be removing the intake and using more silicone sealer in the corners. Thanks for the info. I will make sure he uses FelPro gaskets.
Good afternoon Goodwin, take the bosswrench advice. As an alternative, we don't use the front/rear cork gaskets, we throw them away. Haven't used them in years. Buy a can of 'The RightStuff' and be done with it forever. Pull the intake, clean clean clean. Remove the carburetor. Add a healthy portion of The Right Stuff front & rear, pause for a minute or so. Get a friend to help setting the (lighter more maneuverable) manifold down exactly where it will stay no wiggling around. Get it right the 1st time. It will never leak in a hundred years. Be the best 22 dollars you ever spent on the car, lol. We've never once had to repeat.
If I am missing something, I’m sure someone will point out where I am going wrong, but……
there are, of course, water passages between the cylinder heads and the engine block
But the Cleveland intake manifold is a dry manifold, meaning there are no water passages between the cylinder heads and the intake manifold. There is no water in the intake manifold.
so how in heavens name is WATER leaking out of the manifold to engine block junction at the China wall corners❓❓❓
I can think of no other source for that water than an improperly installed or improperly torqued cylinder head gasket
Larry
As for correctly and easily setting the intake manifold directly in place on your first try, you do not need to have a second pair of hands but you do need four 5/16 inch studs
install them in the four vertical manifold bolt holes to use as guides when lowering the manifold into place
install the other manifold bolts, pull the studs and install those four bolts and torque everything according to the Ford torque instructions
and yes, I strongly endorse the aerosol can of PermaTex right stuff for the China wall gasket
Larry
...Larry 'Hit the Nail Right on the Head!' Miss-Torqued Heads! And The '4 Stud Manifold Alignment', Idea, was First Invented and Suggested By ME! The Bonus is, they also keep the Gasket from Slipping Down, out of Alignment, when you Drop the Manifold Straight Down.
My Iron Heads, on Iron Block, are Installed with ARP Studs and are Torqued to 135 FT/LBS!! Think I'am Wrong...call up the ARP Technicians, Yourself! Aren't using studs?, then Look Up the Head Bolt Torque for the 'BOSS 351', Your heads on Your Block.
MJ
Marlin,
I picked up that tip from you so long ago I had totally forgotten where I got it. Hard to remember what I had for breakfast these days, or even if I had breakfast, much less where I picked up all the little tips and ideas rattling around in my old gray-haired head.
next time I share that tip, I will give you credit, that’s assuming I can remember where I got it ….. 😉
Larry
Since this is a Cleveland engine, the intake manifold does not have any water passages, which has already been stated by Larry.
The only way for water to leak from the head at the area stated is from the head gasket. This could be from not enough head bolt torque, an uneven gasket surface on the head or block (or both), a bad head gasket, or a poorly cleaned gasket surface. This assumes that there are no casting cracks.
BTW, what heads does this engine have?
John
Why haven't you pressure tested it? Simple test, simple find.
Thank you, John😉
Jack and Jack, Sharkey and Bosswrench, appear to have miss-read the original post and have addressed OIL leaking from the China wall corners.
This is understandable, as I have never heard of anything but oil leaking at the China wall…….
but the original post says the leaking fluid is WATER, not oil……
if the cylinder heads were not properly torqued, I would expect water to escape from multiple locations. Since that is not the case, it is likely a HEAD gasket issue.
pull the cylinder head closest to the leak, and find the source of the water leak. Depending on what you find, it may also be wise to pull the other cylinder head.
If all you do is reinstall the intake manifold, I guarantee you will have the oil milkshake appear in short order
Larry
I personally have had issues with the Cometic head gaskets but not on the 351c. On a 427 and 347 Fords. The fact that they are $92 each doesn't make them any better.
Others have had issues with Felpro. I stay with the Felpro unless I need a thinner head gasket to maintain compression ratio.
The 427 would drip oil from the driver's side head, rear, in the corner. The 347 water from the same spot. Changed out the Cometic for Felpro and the problems were solved.
It had nothing to do with having not torqued the heads properly...not a greenhorn here. It was the composite design of the gasket itself.
Cometic refunded the money on both sets and said find another manufacturer.
The only issue with the Felpro's is they are thick and only made one way, BUT they don't leak.
(The original post says "dripping water", not oil)
Hum. I don't personally have experience with copper head gaskets but I remember they were used on 60s era GMC blower cars.
The hardness of them matters as they seal by crush rather than anything else.
I do know that teflon coated gaskets such as the Felpro are designed with crush rings around the cylinders to hold compression but permit the head and block to expand at different rates and the head literally floats on the block.
That is more important of a concept with aluminum heads on iron blocks.
The older Victor gaskets common on Fords of the 60s were sealing differently and we often needed to scrape remnants of them off of the top of the block. The Felpro's, not so much.
Unless you have crazy cylinder pressures, I don't see the need for copper gaskets or maybe stated differently, the risk (water leaks) of using them.
You don't need more then 95 pounds of torque to seal the gaskets. The fasteners aren't doing the job, the gaskets are. The only thing head studs are treating is paranoia. At some point they are counter productive and distorting the head and block.
...Sure! Wanting A 40% Increase in Clamping Force, with the FINE Nut Threads, on a Stud, that Bottoms all the way to the Bottom Length of the Blocks' COURSE Threads, Is Paranoia in your view? When I use to use the Factory Bolts I, like you, was advised to torque the Heads to 90 FT/LBS (you stated 95)...The head gasket Blew when approaching 5700RPM. I replaced them, torqued to 95, a Gasket blew a second time*. The Factory Manuel States 'BOSS 351= 125 FT/LBS'!! My C.R. is 10.5, I then Installed the ARP Studs, as mentioned earlier, called up ARP, I think They have done a 'Little' Testing on their own, their advise...Iron Heads on Iron Block 135FT/Lbs, on the Fine Threaded Nuts?! This while the Engine is In the Car. Torquing while leaning in over the Fender! Yes, the Heads CAN be slid up and over the Studs!! Took all the strength I had to hit 135.
Engine has been running Perfect ever since! Took It to the Desert at 118F Degrees, Never got Hotter than 195F, Period!
And try using 'Head Bolts' in a Aluminum Block, and see what Happens!!
MJ
* Make No Mistake, this was all on Block and Head surfaces that were Re-Dressed for Flatness and Accuracy. And I think I know a Little Bit About a 'Torquing Sequence' and More.
I vote to nominate Marlin for a Special Achievement award as a small token of our appreciation to his outstanding and often unique brilliance!
Will someone second the motion?
