1972 Pre-L for sale, #2518

It's a sad day, but I put my Pantera up for sale. Simply, I don't get to drive it enough.

Many excuses: at the rear of the garage, Danish climate, not much going on in Danish Pantera community (wish I lived in Arizona Chuck), I’ve gotten fed up participating in classic car gettogethers here in Copenhagen area where people sit on the cars etc general chaos, and no tracks to have fun on near me.

So the only use I have for it is trips like my trip to Spa and LMC, where the wife kinda prefers the Longchamp, and so do I if I take a pre-trip around Italy or Switzerland. So maybe I can have more fun with that money and space buying something else.

I had Gallerie Brummen ( http://www.gallery-aaldering.com/en/ ) guy evaluate it, he said €115, looking at the others on mobile.de I've set my price at €119 because it's faster than all of them I think.

If somebody wants a well handling and fast narrow-body Pantera, I think this is a good place to look...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_cAiqZlvnk

BTW; Longchamp is not for sale, so you won't get rid of me entirely...
Original Post
DeTomaso Pantera 2518 for sale, January 1972, €119.900

• Rust free California car imported to Denmark by current owner 7 years ago. Painted 4 years ago
• 593 HP 408 stroker with dynosheet by reputable builder, approx. 10k miles
• ZF looked over and safety wired
• New bushings etc, new brake kit with Wilwood calipers all wheels, billet p-brake calipers
• Never overheats
• Everything works including A/C, though right side window moves very slowly
• Tested with RaceLogic equipment, 0-60 3.92s, 1.00G cornering, 0.96G braking

Further details:
408 MME Racing Stroker
CHI 3V heads and intake
10q oil pan, baffled
Holley Pro Series carb dynoed on this engine
ICE Ignition, ability to change ignition curve and 2 step limiter from driver’s seat
Coated headers
ZF taken apart, checked and safety wired
New clutch 6000 miles ago
Lay down radiator with two puller fans, one on thermostat switch, one controlled manually
All cooling hoses double clamped
Stainless walls firewall and tank, stainless bottles for coolant
A/C OEM works perfectly, thermostat on dash, rarely on full A/C, that’s too cool!
New master and slave clutch cylinders, full clutch action and not very hard to push, send your grandma to the shops in it…
Pantera Electronics Fuse Box and park/turn front signals
No radio, listen to the engine
Body and paint, body completely bare, matchbox size rust patch in left B-pillar, fixed, have pictures
Panels gaps quite good, seen a few better, seen many worse...
Fresh paint, real shiny, a chip or two
Campy clones 17” with Michelin Pilot Sports, 335 at rear
Complete Dennis Quella brake kit, Wilwood and discs, perfectly balanced, rear p-brake calipers replaced with billet ones
All bushings etc replaced in suspension, new adjustable shocks/springs
Low stance, but tires never rubbing on body
New three point belts, if preferred 4 point race belts including cross bar are available
Interior mostly stock, nice seats and carpet, some patina
Driver’s seat moved 1½” to the right, to align with steering wheel, pedals and shifter, makes a world of difference
A thought, how do I get paid. Usually when I've sold cars they have been low value and in Denmark, so cash or bank certified cheque has worked fine. I'd rather not have up to $135k in cash at any time....

Any advice on how to handle payment in a safe way for both buyer and seller?
quote:
Originally posted by No Quarter:
A thought, how do I get paid. Usually when I've sold cars they have been low value and in Denmark, so cash or bank certified cheque has worked fine. I'd rather not have up to $135k in cash at any time....

Any advice on how to handle payment in a safe way for both buyer and seller?


There has to be an element of trust or for piece of mind use an escrow account. I have always wired the money to the sellers account and had the same in my account as a seller, then the title is couriered overnight to the new owner (assuming it does not have to accompany the vehicle for importation etc.) and the car ships as soon as it can be picked up. I do spend some time with the seller on the phone (if I am not personally inspecting the vehicle) and an internet search to verify he/she is who they say they are and address etc., plus get a copy of an ID (license, passport etc.)

What's the newer dream car?

Julian
quote:
What's the newer dream car?

Many thoughts and not there yet, but here's the short list:
-Ferrari 456GTA: Beautiful out and in, and every gearhead should own a complex V12 once in his life, right?
-Maserati GranTurismo: Beautiful out and in, and for some strange reason there's plenty of them for sale here in Denmark, so possible to get a relatively cheap car less than 10 years old (= new in my book)
-Porsche Cayman: Beautiful, not. But they say it's world's best handling sportscar. And it would be nice to own at least one economical car

Surpassing the Pantera on rawness and performance, on that I have given up. Less power will have to suffice.
I thought that was your car that I saw on ebay a couple of days ago, sorry to see you put your cat up for sale but understand. I almost did the same three years ago after I bought my 5.0L XKR. It was just so easy to drive quickly, and I didn't have to worry if it was warmer than 75F or if there was traffic, both of which are assured in Los Angeles about 362 days a year. Instead I chose to make the Pantera more driveable adding new engine, fans, clutch, headers, leather interior, fuel injection......another week or two, and I'll know if it was worth the wait. As to the 456, they are certainly still very reasonably priced if not a little tamer than the Maranello. A word of caution on the Maserati, every person I know, without exception, has had major problems with their Maseratis, no matter what the model, beautiful to look at, great exhaust sound, horrible reliability! And by the way, you can now get a 5.0L XKR in the mid-$20K range, in stock form will easily outperform the Gran Turismo, and with a pulley/tune for about $600, you're above 600hp. These cars are extremely reliable, and you'll have over $120,000's worth of change left in your pocket.

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quote:
Originally posted by tberg:
I thought that was your car that I saw on ebay a couple of days ago, sorry to see you put your cat up for sale but understand. I almost did the same three years ago after I bought my 5.0L XKR. It was just so easy to drive quickly, and I didn't have to worry if it was warmer than 75F or if there was traffic, both of which are assured in Los Angeles about 362 days a year. Instead I chose to make the Pantera more driveable adding new engine, fans, clutch, headers, leather interior, fuel injection......another week or two, and I'll know if it was worth the wait. As to the 456, they are certainly still very reasonably priced if not a little tamer than the Maranello. A word of caution on the Maserati, every person I know, without exception, has had major problems with their Maseratis, no matter what the model, beautiful to look at, great exhaust sound, horrible reliability! And by the way, you can now get a 5.0L XKR in the mid-$20K range, in stock form will easily outperform the Gran Turismo, and with a pulley/tune for about $600, you're above 600hp. These cars are extremely reliable, and you'll have over $120,000's worth of change left in your pocket.

tberg, you might have talked me into it! I looked at Jag XKR ads just now, never had before, and found a reasonably priced fully loaded 2007 XKR Conv. My first car was a convertible, haven't had one since, maybe it's time again.

What are the potential problem areas that you know of? Sorry, but "extremely reliable" and Jag is not my perception, but maybe I'm just like so many other, thinking of past sins?
tberg, disregard my previous posting, because things moved fast today. I went to see a 2007 XKR Conv, I heard it, I drove it, I bought it. What a car, well handling, luxurious, and with the sport exhaust LOUD! Not Pantera loud, but rest-of-the-world loud. And fast. Not Pantera fast, but rest-of-the-world fast.

And a convertible, I have for some time wanted a convertible, I haven't had one since my first car (Triumph Spitfire MKIII).

And a one year warranty...

I went on an English Jag forum, asking for problem areas, there seem to be almost none, at least compared to a Maserati. So I think I got a better car, cheaper and with less crazy repairs in the future I think.

tberg, thanks for the suggestion, never thought I'd own a British car again, my own stupid prejudice...


BTW, anybody want to buy my Pantera, I need the money... Big Grin

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Boy, you're an impulsive one aren't you?! The 2007 has the tried and true 4.2L engine which is very reliable. One of the only problem areas of the 2007 cars is the condensation tube on those cars gets clogged and spills over into the passenger side compartment. There are numerous easy fixes that you can find by going to jaguarforums.com X150. You should join the forum too, it is an incredibly informational source for all issues. I have a silver 5.0L (2010) coupe, that is much quicker than my Pantera was, but with the new engine in the Pantera, I ought to be having some fun. I can tell you that the reliability of the X150 platform with either engine has been exceptional for a high performance/luxury car. There are two things you must be diligent about, checking oil and coolant levels. And since there is no dipstick, it has to be done electronically and takes longer than the owners' manual tells you. So, I just check it every few days before I start the car in the morning, it will register a little low before the first start, but so long as it's in the range, you'll know you're okay. I see your car has the adaptive cruise control, I don't use mine, but it's an option that is relatively rare and coveted by many. You're car is beautiful and the seats look new, how many miles on the car? And since we know you'll want to do modding at some point, there are lots of aftermarket suppliers like Mina Galleries in Los Angeles or Paramount in Europe and many others. Have fun.
Forgive the ramblings of an annoyed old man, but help me understand the market...

My Pantera hasn't sold. Not even close. Of course it's not cheap, I realize that, and for you Americans it must seem even more expensive. But, compare my price to the others on mobile.de, it's not too expensive spec for spec. And on pistonheads.co.uk, last I looked it was the cheapest Pantera! Strange. Of course, if you don't want a Pre-L and if you don't like the non-OEM shiny blue metallic, that can explain it. Still, I wonder why it hasn't sold. At the same time I see either really Plain Jane Panteras sell and I see rebuilt fake "rare" models go for $$$. OK, enough about my frustrations, but help me understand...

My Pantera has 3 strong selling points that apparently don't get the buyers in:
1 600 HP
2 No rust, never rusted, never rust-reparied by anyone with perhaps mediocre skills
3 Everything works, always starts, never overheats, A/C works, could be a daily driver

Ad 1: I thought that in itself would sell this Pantera quick. I've always bought my cars with as much HP as I could afford. The buyer of this Pantera will be able to outrun all his 400-500 HP friends. But apparently potential Pantera owners just don't care about performance? Are they all wimps?! Wink (I'm sure we all agree that the Pantera chassis is good enough to handle 600 HP)
Ad 2: How many are there left out there, that has never been rusted? Many have been repaired, some of them with great skills and patience as can be seen examples of on this forum, but many have been welded by people doing it fast to make money, quality will be varying. You're only a virgin once rust-wise. This is a virgin
Ad 3: Turn key car. Nothing to fix. Of course things will pop up, all Panteras fail occasionally, but all wear parts replaced. When I drive to Spa, I don't prepare anything on the Pantera, I just start it and go

So what kind of buyer contacts have I had? All kinds. Lots of frauds unfortunately, especially from Norway and Germany, they want to buy my car at full price here and now, but I have to take the money cash in $ or €, at a very favourable rate. Too good to be true. And then there are all the companies that will sell it for me, they actually have the buyer already they claim.
The legit buyers, of course some want the price down, and while I'm flexible, some offers are just crazy, damn right offending. Some offers we end €20k from each other, won't work, if it was €10k gap, maybe 5 on each side would seal the deal.
Some ask about matching numbers. Haven't heard that in the first 10 years of Pantera ownership, now I hear it. Not really that relevant for such a modified brand IMO. And why ask for matching numbers on a car with 2x the original HP. Just don't get it.

So there we are, still waiting, learning new stuff every day. If I was in the market for a Pantera and could buy a well sorted 600 HP never rusted Pantera, that's the one I would go for, and I would wear the seller down with bids until he sold it to me Smiler

Any views? Besides "it's too expensive"?
Thanks

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It's worth what buyers are willing to pay. Don't believe all the Mobile.de prices, very few of those trade hands - and at what prices?

quote:
Some offers we end €20k from each other, won't work


That would be around €100k ?? - I would think that's pretty much where the market is at for this kind of car.

My opinion Cool of course.

(I would consider selling my pushbutton for €100k - of course, it's not a 600 HP car Frowner)
quote:
Originally posted by Push1267:
It's worth what buyers are willing to pay. Don't believe all the Mobile.de prices, very few of those trade hands - and at what prices?

quote:
Some offers we end €20k from each other, won't work


That would be around €100k ?? - I would think that's pretty much where the market is at for this kind of car.

My opinion Cool of course.

(I would consider selling my pushbutton for €100k - of course, it's not a 600 HP car Frowner)


I completely agree.
I sold a Porsche 996 TT two years ago, I offered it at a price consistent with mobile.de, autoscout24, etc.... and I have had no buyers for 6 months, I lowered it by 10% and I sold it in one month.
I know Danes and Swedes read this list, so here goes. I’ve sold my Pantera to a nice gentleman from the northern part of Sweden. Next step is getting it up there, from Copenhagen area to 1800 km up into Sweden. It can be driven of course, that’s one option. But he’s also looking into having it delivered. So does anybody know who to contact about such a transport, without breaking the bank?
Got an offer of €1k, can't be done cheaper by flying down and driving up. But up to the buyer of course

tberg, thanks. And yes I got a good price, I'm too stubborn to settle for less, and it took me 10 months to sell it. That said, the buyer was very good at slowly getting my price down, he wore on me for months. I'm sure he's happy too. In parallel I had a potential buyer from Switzerland, we had agreed a higher price, but he had something expensive to sell first, so I waited for that for months. But now it was time to sell... Roll Eyes
quote:
Hope you'll stay on the forum as I enjoy reading your posts.

I still have a Longchamp, so will not be totally away, but I've taken myself of the daily list after too much frustration. I'm on the Jag X150 forum in the UK though. That forum is a bit boring, nobody asks about timing curves, it's more about how to polish, new wheels and the occasional electric gremlin, where replacing the battery is usually the solution Big Grin

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