Passenger side head over heats

Rick, since the engine is disassembled and you seem stuck, how about reassembling the motor with the heads interchanged on the block? If you did and fired the thing on a stand and the same side of the motor gets hot, its a block issue, but if the same head gets hot on the other side of the block, its a head casting issue.

Rick good luck with the troubleshoot. I hope it's something simple.

I don't know what the coolant plenum looks like between the two cylinder banks but is there a way that there could be a restriction on the overheating side?

Is this something that can be checked through the thermostat and restrictor plate opening?

Again good luck with the troubleshoot......

Rocky (a.k.a. Chuck)

quote:

cylinder head gaskets installed correctly

Are you sure? I had the exact same symptoms and it turned out to be that one of my Cometic head gaskets was installed backwards.
And, are you using the CORRECT thermostat; one designed for the 351C with the correct 'hat' that seals against the block plate?

"OOOO, OOOO....Mr.Kotter, Mr. Kotter, I know, I know!"

The carb is super lean at idle. This happened to me to the extent that the iron manifolds I was running the engine in with were GLOWING RED like they were under boost from a super charger.

This most likely is a Holley carb and the issue most likely is the idle air bleed on that side has an issue.

A Holley carb off of a production emmissions engine like the 85 Mustang 302 GT was set up 1) that even if you remove the plugs that cover the idle set screws, those screws only control the volume of fuel at idle not the a/f mixture.

2) That is preset into the carb and will give you theoretically an a/f ratio of 14.7:1 at idle and show something like 700F. Enough to make the exhausts glow. No matter how you adjust the set screws, you will not change the idle a/f ratio (with that carb)

You might interpret it as an overheating situation IF you are going by exhaust temps.

Measure the actual water temps in both heads and the block simultaneously to determine if they vary.

If you have and the one head is hot then ignore me. I just need a nap?

ok, right head only steamed. But you do have an interesting observation. The dyno sheet shows 14.6 a/f at 3500. Sheet doesn't go below that and we only ran it up to 2500 during testing.

Swapping heads around would mean adding new air bleeds which is doable.

Thermostat is a Stant 180 with a block off plate from Dennis Q. Verified opening temp and distance to be within tolerances and correct.

trivia (if you believe engine dyno numbers) 632hp/594tq at 6300

Oh... and the engine builder is out of business. :-/

chi high rise intake
demon 850 (I asked for a 750)

You have the thermostat's block recirc blocked. Are you using the heater hoses to allow coolant to circulate when the thermostat is closed? Might even run without thermostat.

I could see Doug's comments about red hot manifold would also cause one head to be hotter than other.

BTW, how are you determining one head is "steaming"? would that be from your installed head vents? are those vents only at the back of the engine or at the front also

If your dyno sheet shows 14.6 at 3500 then there is something drastically not right with that carb.

Look at both the idle air bleeds and high speed bleeds.

Simpler, borrow a carb from someone and see if the situation changes itself.

Not for nothing but how can it possibly be making 630 something hp when it is that lean? Try 150 to 200 until you start dialing some fuel into it?

Sounds like this guy gave you a fictitious
print out? Were you there when they did the runs?

With any kind of advance in that engine, say 32 to 34, at 14.6:1 you are going to put a hole through a piston?

Change carbs.


In my 2x4 Holley set up with two 1850 carbs the idle air bleeds were changed down to .021" to get the exhaust temps down.

They were so hot with .080" idle bleeds they burned the ceramic coating off of the headers.

No heater hoses. I live in Phoenix!
Bleed valves are on the back of each head only.
None in the front.
We can hear the right head percolating and water comes out the bleed on the driver side when we open it slightly and steam comes out the passenger side.

I had problems with running hot using the Wieand water pump until I took it off and drilled the bypass hole.

If you use the Cleveland thermostat you MUST HAVE the bypass hole drilled in the water pump.

The Wieand pump is not drilled and is intended to be used with the Windsor type of thermostat.

Wieand will give you the, "there is nothing wrong with our Cleveland pump, we have been making it for years" speech.

Confused enough yet? I can do better?

would not using the heater hose connection as a bypass. looping outlet back to inlet.

heater hose ports are sealed.
Exhaust ports and combustion chamber do not show signs of lean burn. They look normal.
still researching...

I had a set of head gaskets that were marked front, but they were reversed. In other words, they were mis-stamped. Make sure you line up the water ports and not rely on that marking. Quality control has become an obsolete historical term that no longer applies.

Coolant is not circulating through the head from point A to point B.

Either it is not flowing out of the water port at the block or not through the head.

You just have one of those one in a million that I personally get in maybe one in 10.

There has to be a blockage in an unexpected place?

It is not beyond the scope of possibilities that a casting remnant has come loose and is blocking the flow.

Sorry for you. This all sucks.

quote:

Originally posted by Rick:
No heater hoses. I live in Phoenix!
Bleed valves are on the back of each head only.
None in the front.
We can hear the right head percolating and water comes out the bleed on the driver side when we open it slightly and steam comes out the passenger side.

...'Bleeding off' the system pressure will INSTANTLY cause the Coolant to Boil into Steam.

Sounds to Me:

1. A percolating sound would be caused by Air Pockets trapped in the Head. Those 'Bleeds' you have 'may' be letting coolant out and Air IN, when you think the Air is being bleed out! If they are not at the highest point in the Head, and they are opened when the Engine is NOT Running.
2. The Stresses of being Stroked could have caused a Cracked Cylinder in the Block. Or a Cracked Head. Also a Blown Head gasket, though you have Not mentioned Oil in the Coolant, or Coolant in the Oil. Or a loss of Coolant. Could have made a Compression Check, only this would take some Guessing out of the Equation.
3. I can't see where the By-Pass would ONLY cause ONE Head to Over-Heat.
4. As Doug said, could be a Blockage.
5. 'I' would Triple Check that Head Gasket!!
a. Correct Gasket installed correctly
b. Do ALL the Holes Align
c. Check the Head for Warpage
d. Torqued EVENLY to 125 Ft/Lbs (Cast Iron Heads on a Cast Iron Block)

...That's all I have.

351C head gasket showing critical check points. This one happens to be a Cometic that was installed backwards (not mine).

Red arrows indicate critical coolant passages. Large hole should be located at the REAR of the block.

Turquoise arrow indicates a "square" corner of the gasket that should be at the FRONT of the block when properly installed.

Square corner is visible when the head is installed.

John

I believe the "sound" you describe is what I call the "gurgle and surge" sound.

One head over-heating has got to be the head gasket oriented improperly (in agreement with my dear friend Mr. Buckman).

That's what I'd hoped it was. Unfortunately the gasket was the one pictured and installed with the correct orientation.

quote:

351c sleeved back to 0

I am NOT a knowledgeable engine guy, but how many cylinders were sleeved?

I have heard that usually only a few cylinders can be sleeved, otherwise not a good idea.

Is it possible adjacent sleeves have diminished/blocked the coolant passages?

Just throwing this idea out as the regular solutions seem to not be solving this issue.

I, too, think your problem is gasket related, but you continue to assure us that has been ruled out.

Larry

head gasket

quote:

Originally posted by JFB #05177:
would not using the heater hose connection as a bypass. looping outlet back to inlet.

the heater loop does create a bypass. lack of any flow path during warm-up causes a dead head condition of the cooling system, the water pump is working against the closed thermostat & there's no coolant flow. the heads will generate hot spots until the T-stat opens, further aggravating a backwards head gasket situation

the only other thing I can think of is if there's a piece of cylinder block material floating around loose in the water jacket back there where the critical coolant passage is in the rear of the passenger side. when a block gets machined for a sleeve, many times there's not enough thickness of the cast cylinder & the machining operation (boring) opens up a window into the water jacket. when the material gets that thin that it's gonna window through, the material deflects & avoids the cutter. that remnant of the missing cylinder bore area will be paper thin & fall out, into the water jacket or it may even hang on by a thread for a time & let loose whenever it wants. if this engine had been sitting for a long time I'd say rust scale could be the culprit but in this multi sleeve build it might be a wafer of cast iron from the boring operation blocking that rear passage