Hello group, this is my first post. Thank you in advance.  I wanted some ideas on dual air cleaners that can connect to the side elephant ears to bring in fresh air that is filtered. can you guys share some pictures of dual air systems.

Where can i find a nice looking cleaner that is ready to install?

I know Spectrum makes one that is round with two outlets, I really don't care fore that look.

Original Post

Gas, if you were looking for a power boost, you can save yourself some time and money by realizing that the Pantera engine compartment is at a slight positive pressure relative to the outside of the body. So airflow into any side scoops does not naturally happen until the boundary layer along the sides of the car thins with very high forward velocity- somewhere in the neighborhood of 150+ mph. Even then, any inward air flow is minimal. So for street driven cars even at 'arrest-me-instantly' road speeds, both the small and 'elephant-ear' side scoops are only cosmetic. They may be attractive but not functional. So bottom line- the hookup doesn't really matter in this case.

To demonstrate this at any road speed, roll the driver's side window down an inch or so, wet your fingertip and inch it out thru the very top/back of the glass opening. Your finger will detect evaporative cooling from air flow only after most if not all your finger is protruding (4" or so?) which is a measure of the boundary layer thickness only inches away from the rear quarter window opening.

There are also illustrated articles elsewhere from the Swedish Pantera club some decades ago in which they did tuft studies to map side and rear airflow. There are also articles in which, even at Bonneville speeds, indications are that functional side scoops if firmly attached to a carb, tend to mess up fuel/air mixtures, confusing tuners & possibly damaging the engine by going lean. Sorry-

I can't recall if I dreamed it, or we did it by email, but I thought JFFR took measurements that showed his filter box became pressurrized.   the info included the "thickness" of his scoops and "speed of air" in his ductwork for full throttled conditions.  If I recall correctly, full throttled/redline caused the air entering the scoops to be about 40mph.   I can't recall the percent of the scoop thickness that was providing ram industion.

an electronic manometer measured pressure in the filter box wrt the pressure over the engine

 found this graph in the bottom of the trash can

JFFR air data

 

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I thinks Jack's (Bosswrench) first point is mute for a sealed intake system and I thought the elephant ears were of sufficient stand off to interrupt the boundary layer? As JT points out do not underestimate the positive impact of accessing clean fresh dense air!

There may be some validity to Jacks' point regarding air/fuel ratio impact at high speed, but not an issue if you are running EFI.

For an air filter I would personally opt for one central unit with two feeders, I think the available filtration area will be significantly more than the in line filter options.

joules posted:

There may be some validity to Jacks' point regarding air/fuel ratio impact at high speed, but not an issue if you are running EFI.

Carburetor's respond to changes in air density too.

I often chime-in on the topics of ram air and cold air because the two are often confused. They are not the same subject. The horsepower produced by any engine operating at any speed benefits from lowering the temperature of the air it inhales. There is a 1% horsepower improvement for every 10 degrees F the air temperature is lowered. I learned that when I was about 10 years old. It is TRUE that ram air is only effective at illegal speeds. If you're not racing, there will be no benefit from "RAM AIR" but that doesn't negate the benefit of the cold air that the scoops shall pull-in.

Cold air is a viable goal, but there are certain BIGGER issues I think should be prioritized and emended first before putting time and money into cold air:
(1) the emissions tuned factory carburetor should be replaced with a carburetor tuned for performance,
(2) the engine's compression ratio should be raised to approximately 10:1.
(3) the exhaust system's performance should be improved
(4) the exhaust heat should be blocked from the intake manifold.

Finally … to recover the good mid-range power that comes from heated air causing the fuel droplets to flash into the gas-state, you need to utilize a carburetor with annular booster venturis, because annular boosters atomize the fuel better, and smaller fuel droplets will flash into the gaseous state more easily than larger fuel droplets.  

Thank you John! you hit the nail on the head! 

The original poster asked for recommendations on how to " to bring in fresh air that is filtered." He said NOTHING about a "ram air effect"  yet the immediate response is that " both the small and 'elephant-ear' side scoops are only cosmetic ". I say that getting air to the engine from the 1/4 window area is better than getting air from under the car which has been heated by the radiator , front brakes, coolant tubes, exhaust headers and the 180deg engine before making it's way into the air cleaner even if there is no " ram air" effect at all. 

 

Ron

Cooler air intake works to a degree. The intercooler on my TT turbo drops the intake charge 42 degrees. I measured the temp.

On a naturally aspirated engine, all that would do is freeze up the induction system. My Holley would literally ice up with the air temps at around 40f. The heat crossover was blocked.

The trade off of a couple of extra hp vs. practical use isn't worth it in my view.

With the Pantera, a few have gone to Pontiac Fiero roof scoops. Ram air is useless. It's ducting for cooler air that you want...again, to a degree.

Considering the huge blind spots this car has, why make it worse? The bat ears block an important view point on the Pantera. You could go to clear lexan as a solution though like Ferarri did on the F40.

Even so, it's just and academic exercise. No matter where you put ducting back there, it interferes with something else.

Quite a few Pantera owners found that just removing the rear side glass, accomplishes the same thing and it blocks nothing.

  Thanks for all the information I really appreciate it.

I bought my Pantera from a woman in San Diego area , the husband had passed away. I have no engine specs, the engine runs good on 100 octane fuel, I know it has high compression engine and a performance cam does not like to idle very well, crazy intake manifold and 180 headers , my 1/4 windows are out, the rear engine cover has louvers on it . I just wanted to bring in fresh cooler air an experiment to see what happens. 

I have a very busy auto shop in LA , hopefully this summer I can modify the cooling system, I was going to remove the original copper radiator and make mounts so it is little tilted just like the aluminum radiators so I can install two sucker fans and have run little cooler. I forgot to mention it is set up with all the NOX plumbing and the bottle is in front I never have used it.

Bussard’s ALL-PRO Auto. 

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29C62F5C-3F96-4B8B-9E9D-81AFDF3E3435

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Having owned a dyno and seeing first hand the benefits of getting cool/dense air into an engine I am a firm believer that it is worth it to do so.  Air density benefits from cool air will be beneficial to ANY engine regardless of its existing power levels. Denser air=more air=more power. On more powerful engines with higher compression ratios where the knock threshold of the engine is closer to the ignition timing that makes peak power the benefit of cooler air can be even more beneficial. I have seen some combinations that could not reach ideal timing with the hot air in an engine compartment. I personally gained 25HP moving the intake on my meteor into cooler air jut due to the ability get get ideal timing into it. On every setup I build every effort is made to pick up air outside of the engine compartment. As for the original question, something similar to this perhaps? https://www.ramairbox.com/

Interesting Exchange of info, didn't the Factory pull "Cool or Cooler Air" in to the Stock Air Cleaner from the Bottom of the Car. My 73 had a air intake hose to the air cleaner mounted in front of the Passenger back tire. Isn't that why we put Spoilers and Air dams on our Cars because of all the air going Under the Car creating Lift at speed? Why not pull air from under the Car?

 

I don't care what anyone says. I think those Hall headers with the side exhausts are cool.If you watch them in the dark, they throw flames.

Those are the first design 180 headers Gary made. Then he found out that they would warp some and hard to disassemble and reassemble on the car.

Second design has the center flanges.

That car appears in Hall's early catalogs showing the louvres. Kind of a bad ass. I like it's attitude. Matches mine. No one is ever going to ask me to pass the Grey Poopon.

jfb05177 posted:

I can't recall if I dreamed it, or we did it by email, but I thought JFFR took measurements that showed his filter box became pressurrized.   the info included the "thickness" of his scoops and "speed of air" in his ductwork for full throttled conditions.  If I recall correctly, full throttled/redline caused the air entering the scoops to be about 40mph.   I can't recall the percent of the scoop thickness that was providing ram industion.

an electronic manometer measured pressure in the filter box wrt the pressure over the engine

 found this graph in the bottom of the trash can

JFFR air data

 

I took digital manometer readings from 10 mph up to 120 mph  with readings every 10 mph with my sealed air box system that is connected to the small window side scoops. There was a positive pressure increase with every 10 mph, although it was in tenths, which shows that it isn't really a ram air system. What is best about this system is that the inlet air temperature reading from my EFI system shows that there is 40 degree cooler air coming into the engine with the scoops attached vs them not being attached. Without a sealed air box, you would never be able to overcome the air pressure in the engine bay by using the side scoops unless you were able to go faster than most Panteras could ever go.

 

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