Mangusta Engine Removal and Rebuild

I don't have much in the way of answers but good luck to you on this project!

You may have seen the thread from the recent past where removal of the rear hatches was discussed. Apparently, that can all be peeled off with the help of a friend or two.

Just speculating but I doubt there is room to un-mate the motor and trans inside the car. Not sure.

Just a few days ago, I was driving 8MA-596 when suddenly I was greeted by the sounds of major engine failure and the car promptly shut down. Luckily I was in a safe location and was able to flatbed the car a short distance home. So now I am facing a similar project.

Good luck and please do post some updates to the thread, I'm sure plenty of us look forward to watching your progress.

I know very little about the Mangusta but there is an excellent blog on removing the Pantera engine here, might be helpful:
https://www.coloradopantera.com/351crebuild.html

I have been there before, the trans comes out first.

Hey MH,

It's been a while since I pulled mine,. The spine and wings and then headers off obviously. Then also remove the jack-shaft assembly (the front pulley will smash the rear glass). Remove the starter and AC condenser, and all hoses/wires etc. I removed my engine and ZF as a unit and it was probably easier than separating them (but I've only ever removed them as a unit from Panteras as well). Once all is disconnected it's a quick job.

I've about decided to swap to a 331 Stroker with roller rockers/cam (per Lee's suggestion).  Right now I'm shopping...  CNC Motorsports was recommended by a friend.  Does anyone have any other rec's or experience with a crate engine builder?

MH

@jmardy posted:

I know very little about the Mangusta but there is an excellent blog on removing the Pantera engine here, might be helpful:
https://www.coloradopantera.com/351crebuild.html

Nice blog, obvious adjustments will be made for a goose, but it's close enough to start planning.

Thanks,

MH

@markcharlton posted:

Hey MH,

It's been a while since I pulled mine,. The spine and wings and then headers off obviously. Then also remove the jack-shaft assembly (the front pulley will smash the rear glass). Remove the starter and AC condenser, and all hoses/wires etc. I removed my engine and ZF as a unit and it was probably easier than separating them (but I've only ever removed them as a unit from Panteras as well). Once all is disconnected it's a quick job.

Pictures are very helpful, Thanks!

MH

*IF* I go with a crate engine, I'm thinking a long block and using original flywheel, intake / carb setup.  Any thoughts on ignition?  I've seen some nice MSD units, but as we all know it's a tight fit in there.

so far this one seems to be the best bang for the buck

https://www.tristarengines.com...ler-camshaft-lifters

Good reviews with good warranty & service.

MH

Do Mangustas have an engine number tag like the Pantera? Is that an issue for value?

I'm running a Progression Ignition and am a huge fan:
https://progressionignition.co...mall-cap-distributor

The ability to see live timing and adjust on the fly is great. I have 1000 miles or so on it and it's been flawless. Size-wise very similar to the MSD Pro billet. No interference issues with Pantera using stock or aftermarket air cleaners.

@jmardy posted:

Do Mangustas have an engine number tag like the Pantera? Is that an issue for value?

I'm running a Progression Ignition and am a huge fan:
https://progressionignition.co...mall-cap-distributor

The ability to see live timing and adjust on the fly is great. I have 1000 miles or so on it and it's been flawless. Size-wise very similar to the MSD Pro billet. No interference issues with Pantera using stock or aftermarket air cleaners.

The block isn't stamped (to my knowledge), there is an aluminum tag bolted to the intake manifold (which I have).

That's a nice looking distributor, one the Mangusta the air cleaner is right up against it, I'll try to compare dimensions to see if it'll clear.  Thanks for the link.

MH

Mangusta blocks are not typically stamped with a Ford serial number as they were supplied in bulk to DT blank. The intake IS stamped with the "engine number" that corresponds to build sheets. I think many of the people claiming they have the original engine may not even know that they do (or don't). The easy tell is if it has a stamped Ford number, it's not original to the car.

I decided to go the rebuild route and do the 331 stroker as well. My engine shop did use the original heads and intake, but did open up ports to help improve flow. I ended up with around 310HP and 400 ft-lbs of torque in an engine that sounds absolutely awesome, yet appears completely stock from the outside (carb and distributor aside).

@markcharlton posted:

Mangusta blocks are not typically stamped with a Ford serial number as they were supplied in bulk to DT blank. The intake IS stamped with the "engine number" that corresponds to build sheets. I think many of the people claiming they have the original engine may not even know that they do (or don't). The easy tell is if it has a stamped Ford number, it's not original to the car.

I decided to go the rebuild route and do the 331 stroker as well. My engine shop did use the original heads and intake, but did open up ports to help improve flow. I ended up with around 310HP and 400 ft-lbs of torque in an engine that sounds absolutely awesome, yet appears completely stock from the outside (carb and distributor aside).

Which distributor did you go with?  any clearance issues?

One of the crate engine companies asked if I wanted/needed the block with the clutch pivot point...  since all gooses (geese?) have a hydraulic clutch, I'm assuming that's a "no".

I have a brand new set of headers (I think from Hall) that the previous owner purchased, but never installed...  this would be the time if I want to install them, I'm just not sure how much of a difference they will make though.  Like you, I want to "appear" stock.

MH

M!ke, I'm with Mark on the engine removal--its straightforward to bring it out with the ZF. Removing the jackshaft first is necessary. Take special care with the oil pan, at least if its original, even consider getting cheap repro pan during the process of removal and transport. The original pan (with oil temp sender and pointer) is a neat thing to have.

You may locate the gullwing mounting before removal--meaning, use a very small drill bit and drill a hole at the spine, so you can locate the position easier when putting back on. Getting a good fit of the engine covers is not easy. See picture on 8ma1046.

  After that, the good news is that it is all Ford, and if leave it all in original tune you might be happy forever. I installed Pertronix ignition modules in 8ma1046 and 1076--I am not a believer in colorful/fancy ignition, and only went back with more hydraulic cam (which just requires screw in studs, but keep the high compression heads), and polished and balanced the rods (and lord knows why, its not like I'm going to be speed shifting at 6000 rpm...).  A roller cam and the stroker kit are not going to hurt the value of the car, and just may help the driveability. But more than that may be a 'stay busy/spend money' trap,  a Tesla 3 is still going to be faster and you may just be happy having the car in great tune again... I would personally work to keep as many external pieces in place as possible, even including the original headers.

Geez, your car has 52 year old paint and the engine has never been out? Pretty awesome...Lee

Hi M!ke, one thought about those Hall headers.  Before you pull the motor (but have the existing headers off) I'd test fit BOTH Hall units to see if they line up properly.   Mine certainly didn't.... off by 1-2".... which required much painful tube cutting & welding .  There may have been more than one Hall header design down through the years but the set I got - cheap as it was - was no bargain!

About the jackshaft, as long as you take the front pulley off, you can pull the motor without removing the whole jackshaft assembly.  That said, you'll probably find insufficient clearance for sliding the pulley off the end of the shaft unless the powertrain is 'loose' and angled or moved a bit to make space.  I was surprised how tight things are at that end of the jackshaft....on 1010 (w/ non stock manifold) I've never had any luck installing a fully assemble jackshaft back on a fully mounted engine....just not enough space.  Always need to install the front pulley 'mid-assembly', one way or another.

Good luck with the project, be interested to see things come back together!  Regards, Nate

(my story on the headers, when I called to order replacements a few decades ago, Bev Hall said they had both the original ANSA and also their own header, either for $400. I said original and she replied "Oh, you don't want that..." .

@leea posted:

(my story on the headers, when I called to order replacements a few decades ago, Bev Hall said they had both the original ANSA and also their own header, either for $400. I said original and she replied "Oh, you don't want that..." .

Biased much?  😜  sounds like she wanted you to buy theirs.

So which did you go with?

MH

@nate posted:

Hi M!ke, one thought about those Hall headers.  Before you pull the motor (but have the existing headers off) I'd test fit BOTH Hall units to see if they line up properly.   Mine certainly didn't.... off by 1-2".... which required much painful tube cutting & welding .  There may have been more than one Hall header design down through the years but the set I got - cheap as it was - was no bargain!

About the jackshaft, as long as you take the front pulley off, you can pull the motor without removing the whole jackshaft assembly.  That said, you'll probably find insufficient clearance for sliding the pulley off the end of the shaft unless the powertrain is 'loose' and angled or moved a bit to make space.  I was surprised how tight things are at that end of the jackshaft....on 1010 (w/ non stock manifold) I've never had any luck installing a fully assemble jackshaft back on a fully mounted engine....just not enough space.  Always need to install the front pulley 'mid-assembly', one way or another.

Good luck with the project, be interested to see things come back together!  Regards, Nate

Thanks Nate, good to know the headers might be Hiding an issue.  I have a spare seat of heat shields...  Will have to see if they can be fitted to keep it stock looking.

Are there conflicts fitting the jackshaft to aftermarket intake manifolds?

Thanks guys

MH

M!ke, I went with the Hall headers--and decades later, at least the idea of 'disguising' them to look like Ansa is where I'd go instead....Strange that one of the things I'd like to do is get the smog pump back on and maybe even working, have the heat riser for the mechanical choke (instead of the electrical kit on it now), and cover over with the heat shields...

btw, the talk then with Gary Hall on the manifold then was 'leave it' (its a good, wide range dual plane manifold. Thank goodness I didn't swap the manifold, decades ago I didn't think any of the Ford pieces were precious and who knew then that the engine number was on the intake...Lee

MH, while the powertrain is out, you could pull the top cover and check for safety wire in your ring gear bolts. This is usually not as much of a problem with Mangustas as it is on Panteras, but with your run of luck with the car recently.... If you're careful in pulling the cover, you won't need to replace the gasket. The clutch pivot thingy on the block is a Mustang attachment. And check the jackshaft before replacing it. Seems like the center bearing is the one that goes out.