Flashers / Turn Signal Don't Work... Any Electrical Experts?

It sounds like the hazard switch is bad. Turn on the ignition switch, move the turn signal switch to indicate a turn (either L or R). Then try wiggling the hazard switch button a very small amount and see if you get a flash from the turn signal indicator in the tach. If you get the turn signal to at least flash, then the hazard switch is bad. Even if you don't get the "flash", the switch could still be bad.

Disconnect the nylon connector for the hazard switch (behind the dash). On the wire loom side of the nylon connector (NOT the switch side), place a jumper wire between the terminal with the red wire and the terminal with the yellow wire (NOT the yellow/black wire). The turn signals should work (key in run position). You can leave this jumper in place so that you can drive the car (and have the turn signals working) until you receive a new hazard switch.

The backup lights may be connected to fuse #3, which means that you need to have the lights turned on (parking lights position or headlight position) for the backup lights to work. The backup lights are a small green wire and can be moved to fuse #10, 11, or 12. This will allow the backup lights to work without the lights having to be turned on (key must be on).

John

Thanks, John -

I will try what you say.

I should note that after my poking around in the kick-panel, now my seat belt buzzer doesn't work any more.

I am starting to believe that there are numerous marginal connectors in my harness.

Thanks Again -

Rocky

I had two more questions on both wiring and flashers. I appreciate any help....

Question 1: How does the flasher really work? It seems like power is applied to the Flasher when the key is on, and that the flasher actually "flashes" when either the Hazard Switch or the Turn Signal applies a load (the appropriate bulb filaments to ground) on the OUTPUT of the flasher. It does not seem like the power is applied to the flasher unit when the blinker is turned on...Is this right?

Question 2: When doing an ATO Fuzebox Conversion... Do people cut / reattatch the terminals that mate to the spade terminals on the fuse box? Or do they just clean up the terminals and plug them into the new fuzebox with no change?


Thanks -

Rocky

Rocky,

1. The flasher is fed hot (key on), and needs a load to function.

2. The terminals reattach to the new ATO fuse panel with no change. Obviously, if a terminal is bad, it will need to be replaced.

John

Thanks, John -

Sure appreciate your expertise and help.

Regards -

Rocky

Here's what I did. I found the switch was good - the problem seems to be in the feed to the "hot side" of the flasher (Yellow Wire to Pin 49).

It turns out that the Seat Belt Buzzer and Ignition Buzzer are also "fed hot" and the grounds are connected when the buzzers are buzzing.

These give a "switched 12V" in the drivers kickpanel.

By making a short jumper I was able to provide switched power to the Hazard Flasher / Turn signal circuit from the seat belt buzzer. This allows me to run either hazard or turn signals (as long as the ignition is on).

I am still troubleshooting the bad wire, but I think that is in the fuse panel. That's an upcoming project.

Thanks for the suggestions -

Rocky

Rocky,

It sounds like one set of contacts in the hazard switch may be bad. Verify that you have +12v on the green wire (pin 30), and on the red wire (pin 15, key on) at the hazard switch. You can also check this at the nylon connector. If you have +12v at both of those pins, and no power on the yellow wire at pin 30, then the hazard switch contacts for pins 15, 30, & 49 are bad.

Depending upon which wire loom your car has, this circuit exits fuse #8 via a yellow or violet wire. There are two green wires that are spliced into this yellow or violet wire. One green wire goes to the hazard switch pin 30, and the other green wire goes to the wiper and washer switches.

Try adding a jumper wire between pins 15 & 49 on the hazard switch. This will allow the turn signals and hazard lights to work (key on for both). Next, move the jumper to pins 30 & 49. This should allow both the turn signals and the hazard lights to work with the key off. If that works, then some of the hazard switch contacts are bad.

John

Thanks, John -

Appreciate the detailed instructions. I will post up my results after troubleshooting via your recommendations. Thanks -

EDITED: Alright, though - how do you get your head / hands up there to see (much less check) any of those wires? It took me 15 minutes just to thread my emergency hood release cable! I looked for the hazard switch - I think I can see it, but it's TIGHT!

But... I shall not give up! I'll figure it out!

I will reply, as I want this to help someone in the future. I always hate it when there is a thread on electrical issues that have a bunch of information, and the OP never "closes out" the story.

Thanks Again.

Rocky

quote:

EDITED: Alright, though - how do you get your head / hands up there to see (much less check) any of those wires? It took me 15 minutes just to thread my emergency hood release cable! I looked for the hazard switch - I think I can see it, but it's TIGHT!

Not sure when this was edited, but you may have to do the checks at the nylon connector (following the color codes).

Any progress ?? I may be in Tuscon on 02/11 or 02/12 (don't know for sure yet).

John

quote:

I will reply, as I want this to help someone in the future. I always hate it when there is a thread on electrical issues that have a bunch of infromation, and the OP never "closes out" the story...

I hate it, but now I are one! (someone who never closes out his problem)

Actually, since I made my jumper and got Hazards / Turn Signal function back, this issue has fallen way down on my priority list.

Let us know about your trip. Maybe we can get together for conversation. Are you driving your Pantera out?

Rocky

No Pantera this trip. I've already contacted Wade.

John

No real progress yet, but I thought I would take another look at things.

I am 100% convinced the problem is in the power feed to the flasher (Yellow wire to pin 49). While I can read 11.7 VDC on it (only in the second ignition detent - Ignition On?), I can not light a test light from it. I think it has a bad connection somewhere...

it could be in the flasher switch, but I don't think so, as the Hazard Switch is "downstream" of the Flasher itself. all flashing & turn signals work fine if I plumb (switched) power to the flasher unit.

In my notes on the car, I found that back in 2001, the previous owner had a repair... " Falshers Not Working - check out turn signal and and hazard system wiring found no power on yellow wire to flasher. repari power feed to flasher at fuse block. Recheck turn signal and hazard system - checkout OK"

So I think I am going to work backwards on that yellow wire, and see how they connected it up.

While I am at it, I will check my backup lights - they still don't work even with the lights on. So I need to look for that too. I like the idea of the B/U lights coming on whenever the car is in reverse, even of the running lights are off.

Thanks for getting me thinking about this again. I'll let you know as I learn more.

Regards -

Rocky

Sounds like the problem may be at the fuse panel connection.

For the backup lights, check for +12v on the green wire at the backup light switch (key in the run position). If no power there, then check the green wire at the nylon connector by the coolant tanks. Do this check with the nylon connector connected, and insert the test probe into the back of the nylon connector on the firewall side of the connector. If no power there, then check the green wire at fuse #12.

If there is no power in the first two tests (backup light switch and nylon connector), repeat the test(s) with the parking lights on.

If you (or anyone else) find that the backup lights only come on when the parking lights (or headlights) are on (shifter in reverse), then there will be a small green wire connected to fuse #3 (sometimes fuse #4). If you want to have the backup lights come on whenever the shifter is in reverse (and key on), you can move this green wire to any open terminal on fuse #10, 11, or 12. As an FYI, fuse #10 is the first "click" of the ignition, and fuses #11 & 12 are on the second click.

John

Yellow wire comes from hazard switch. Maybe high resistance through the warning switch. Note: turn signals only work when ignition is in run position. This has caused a number of people grief who assume that they should work in the acc position.
Good luck
Forest

Making a little (more) progress. Traced (and fixed) the Back-Up Light issue. Had a problem with the contacts on the switch. The contacts (seem to) have rotated around. The insulation over one of the female spade was completely melted, and the two pins on the switch were shorting.

I cleaned all that up, separated the terminals, put an insulator between the switch terminals, and a wire sheath over the harness to the switch.

I am surprised they now work with the the lights On / Off, with the ignition in Run.

I figured the short would have blown the fuse, or my BU lights would have been on all the time, but, I can't complain about the fix.

Anyway - another task behind me.

Now - on to fixing that Yellow Wire!

Thanks -

Rocky (a.k.a. Chuck)

CLOSEOUT: Bad Hazard Switch.....

I finally figured out what you guys were trying to tell me.

My Hazard switch is bad on the INPUT power side - between (pins 30 (Green Wire) and 15 (Red Wire)) and Pin 49 (Yellow Wire). The rest of the switch is good.

I proved this to myself by pulling apart the Nylon Connector, and jumpering power directly from the Green with to the flasher (a different Pin 49), and the Red wire and the flasher.

In both cases everything worked as expected when (Green) Flasher Button Pushed, and (Red) Turn Signal activated with Ignition in RUN position.

Thanks, guys (esp. John). I just didn't get it that the Yellow wire is an OUTPUT, coming through the switch, and then a lot of stuff goes BACK through the switch.

Crazy!

Rocky

Excellent! Glad you finally solved it.

You can leave a jumper between the red and the yellow wires on the "car" side of the nylon connector (connector disconnected) so that you can drive the car and have turn signals.

John

Actually, the way I currently have it ("temp") wired is to run the seat belt buzzer line into Pin 49 of the Flasher.

This gives me power to the circuit when the ignition is in RUN, so Hazard and Turn Signals work.

So I loose my seat belt buzzer (no big deal).

I also can't run the Hazard flashers without the ignition on. This is probably a good reason to (eventually) spend $90 for a new Hazard switch.....

Thanks -

Rocky