HEY George, it looks like he fixed that weak spot between the mains and the cam bearings. I bet this block would let you turn ten grand easy as pie. 
quote:Originally posted by accobra:
Remember years ago .. the drag racers used to use a new block in the tow vehicle to season it prior to machining it for race prep ..thats why I would check it again.
I used to work at an authorized Ford remanufacturer in Edmonton, Alberta, and I have bored, sleeved, and decked hundreds and hundreds of Ford V8 blocks.
The oil patch went through these motors like salted peanuts, and of course returned the core that they replaced. Often, that core was an engine that we had already rebuilt.
My observation was that a "new" block took as many as a dozen passes to get its decks square and flat, whereas the slightest kiss with the surfacer made a previously remanufactured block clean.
My conclusion was that the cast iron moved around quite a bit as it was seasoned, but once seasoned, it was very, very stable.
Aside: operating the boring bar in a production line environment is the world's most aptly named job.
quote:Originally posted by DeTom:
Great, Doug, Ron and Larry you prove my point. Every Pantera owner will want one. They will have two and a half times the power they were designed to handle. You guys will go out and become public menaces and Nancy Pelosi will ban Panteras as being too dangerous to allow ordicnary citizens to own. Only Police and military should be allowed to have assault Panteras. You mark my words, you hot rodders will screw it up for the rest of us.
Man those grapes are sour. :P
Nancy will allow them under an amnesty program that allows migrant workers on her fram to keep them under the "no strikes" and you're in program. This will be attached to a bill in the Senate banning full term fun at short term functions.
That is very cool to see. Reminds me of making fishing weights in shop class - only a million times more complicated
But a serious question - Is this an aluminum alloy? Do we know what the recipe is? Or purity? I would think this is a concern for a block of this type & size.
But a serious question - Is this an aluminum alloy? Do we know what the recipe is? Or purity? I would think this is a concern for a block of this type & size.
This is not an issue for me. Tod Buttermore knows what he's doing, he has a proven track record. He's not a young man and his career is in the foundry business (he's a pattern maker). He has been involved in at least 2 other successful engine block projects (both 427 FE blocks). So he's no newcomer to building engine blocks, this is not a one-time deal for him and he has a reputation to maintain. However I'm sure if you asked him he would tell you both the alloy and the heat treat he plans to use, why he selected this alloy, his experience with the alloys he used in the past, what the industry standard is, etc.
cowboy from hell
cowboy from hell
George,
Any idea as to how long it might be before we could buy one of these things?
Art(broken engine)Stephens
Any idea as to how long it might be before we could buy one of these things?
Art(broken engine)Stephens
Sorry Art, no.
That sure is pretty!
Wow thats a thing of beauty ... so when ????
Ron
Ron
quote:Originally posted by accobra:
... so when ...
Quoting the Cleveland Forum
"Several people have asked about release of blocks for purchase. At this time I am looking to buy my own machine to machine these parts and other parts that have presented themselves lately. If I have to depend on someone else to do my machining for me I might as well stop where I am, cut the pattern into little pieces, and move along. I am looking into financing and have a few machines I am considering. These things move at a glacial pace it seems, so bear with me as I do my best to get to the final stages of this project. I'm doing what I can when I can...Tod"
PROGRESS REPORT
Quoting the Cleveland Forum
"I have machined the bottom end of the sample block and am very pleased with the part so far. I am making very slow progress due to several hinderances. At the pattern shop, not only did a massive amount of work come in to interupt my time on the block project, but their CNC controller went down after a storm and I had to pull the whole CPU box to ship it for repairs. It first started acting up while I was cutting waterjacket core boxes. Then it went down completely while I was cutting something for them. Moving has slowed me down quite a bit. And now it looks like I have a shot at a project manager's position at a very prestigious aluminum foundry. They just lost their man and were recommended by my machine shop owner friend to call me. We talk on Tuesday. It's an hour away but the money and work seem to make the decision for me. I may have to pass off all machining to my friend's shop.
On other notes, Pro-gram Engineering has offered a deal to be the main-cap supplier for all blocks...Tod"
Quoting the Cleveland Forum
"I have machined the bottom end of the sample block and am very pleased with the part so far. I am making very slow progress due to several hinderances. At the pattern shop, not only did a massive amount of work come in to interupt my time on the block project, but their CNC controller went down after a storm and I had to pull the whole CPU box to ship it for repairs. It first started acting up while I was cutting waterjacket core boxes. Then it went down completely while I was cutting something for them. Moving has slowed me down quite a bit. And now it looks like I have a shot at a project manager's position at a very prestigious aluminum foundry. They just lost their man and were recommended by my machine shop owner friend to call me. We talk on Tuesday. It's an hour away but the money and work seem to make the decision for me. I may have to pass off all machining to my friend's shop.
On other notes, Pro-gram Engineering has offered a deal to be the main-cap supplier for all blocks...Tod"
I have been in contact with Tod and have this update for everyone:
As posted on the cleveland forum, Tod will be delivering blocks to engine builders soon, and expects to produce his first run of blocks soon afterwards. He is readying to begin production.
The following is copied and pasted from the Cleveland Forum:
I am heading into the machining phase of the project so it is just a matter of time now until blocks will be ready for test building and then sales. I have avoided taking deposits up till now lest people attach the Genesis debaucle to my project. They took deposits without even having a pattern completed. I have a partially machined block with tooling and fixturing underway. I have invested quite a bit of myself and my money into this and thus I am not fearful to say that I am at the point where I am comfortable to take deposits on the first blocks that will be produced.
My plan is to do aluminum fist, since it is easier to machine, and my machine shop has gone through the learning curve on the FE blocks already. I have some 25 people interested in the aluminum already and another 25 interested in iron. By this I mean I have that many names on file. I imagine that once I begin taking deposits takers will come out of the woodwork. Guys on the Cleveland forum have been loyal and patient supporters of my efforts so far, and so I would like to offer my promised discounted price to Cleveland forum members.
Those who want aluminum are looking at $2600.00
Those who are going to want iron are in at $2100.00
I would like to see a 30% deposit on the discounted price. When these things start to ship I will be completing the sale according to the order in which deposits were made. I believe to be fair that I must refuse to take full payments.
For members of the Pantera International Forums:
Any member of the PI forums who is willing to make the 30% deposit shall receive the same discount that was offered to the members of the Cleveland forum, this includes members who expressed interest previously AND any members who have just made the decision to purchase a block.
Tod Buttermore
tlb427@sbcglobal.net
As posted on the cleveland forum, Tod will be delivering blocks to engine builders soon, and expects to produce his first run of blocks soon afterwards. He is readying to begin production.
The following is copied and pasted from the Cleveland Forum:
I am heading into the machining phase of the project so it is just a matter of time now until blocks will be ready for test building and then sales. I have avoided taking deposits up till now lest people attach the Genesis debaucle to my project. They took deposits without even having a pattern completed. I have a partially machined block with tooling and fixturing underway. I have invested quite a bit of myself and my money into this and thus I am not fearful to say that I am at the point where I am comfortable to take deposits on the first blocks that will be produced.
My plan is to do aluminum fist, since it is easier to machine, and my machine shop has gone through the learning curve on the FE blocks already. I have some 25 people interested in the aluminum already and another 25 interested in iron. By this I mean I have that many names on file. I imagine that once I begin taking deposits takers will come out of the woodwork. Guys on the Cleveland forum have been loyal and patient supporters of my efforts so far, and so I would like to offer my promised discounted price to Cleveland forum members.
Those who want aluminum are looking at $2600.00
Those who are going to want iron are in at $2100.00
I would like to see a 30% deposit on the discounted price. When these things start to ship I will be completing the sale according to the order in which deposits were made. I believe to be fair that I must refuse to take full payments.
For members of the Pantera International Forums:
Any member of the PI forums who is willing to make the 30% deposit shall receive the same discount that was offered to the members of the Cleveland forum, this includes members who expressed interest previously AND any members who have just made the decision to purchase a block.
Tod Buttermore
tlb427@sbcglobal.net
Members interested in purchasing the new block, please read the above post.
I need clarification of what machining will be done to the block ??? I'm up for giving him a deposit on the Aluminum version. Whats the address.
Ron
Ron
Ron,
the subject has been covered here (above) and on the Cleveland forum. The block will be delivered to you requiring the same amount of finish machining as would a block from Ford Racing, Dart or World Products. The block is not ready for assembly, because an engine shop would not want it that way. Engine builders prefer to perform their own final machine work.
You may want to review the posts above, or on the Cleveland forum. Beyond that, I'd recommend you contact Tod directly at his email address:
tlb427@sbcglobal.net
Tod is out of town this weekend, so if you email him, he will not respond immediately.
cowboy from hell
the subject has been covered here (above) and on the Cleveland forum. The block will be delivered to you requiring the same amount of finish machining as would a block from Ford Racing, Dart or World Products. The block is not ready for assembly, because an engine shop would not want it that way. Engine builders prefer to perform their own final machine work.
You may want to review the posts above, or on the Cleveland forum. Beyond that, I'd recommend you contact Tod directly at his email address:
tlb427@sbcglobal.net
Tod is out of town this weekend, so if you email him, he will not respond immediately.
cowboy from hell
George,
I knew that but up until the time when it was said they were getting sold thru a Engine builder I thought different. But I went back and reviewed ..thanks for clearing that up.
Ok I;m ready ...just in time ... my 351W SVO block has not been touched yet ... do you think my SCAT crank and rods would fit the C block .. it would right ..I ordered in with C mains.
Ron
I knew that but up until the time when it was said they were getting sold thru a Engine builder I thought different. But I went back and reviewed ..thanks for clearing that up.
Ok I;m ready ...just in time ... my 351W SVO block has not been touched yet ... do you think my SCAT crank and rods would fit the C block .. it would right ..I ordered in with C mains.
Ron
YES!!
I'm up for sending a deposit .. where do we send it.
Ron
Ron
Tod hasn't given out that info yet.
He went out of town this weekend.
The best thing to do is email him, tell him you're up for the deposit, and wait for his reply.
cowboy from hell
He went out of town this weekend.
The best thing to do is email him, tell him you're up for the deposit, and wait for his reply.
cowboy from hell
I got a response from Todd and he says he will take deposits when he has enough "for real" takers. Apparently out of all those previously interested only 10 have stepped up so far.
This has gotta be a great option for Pantera owner's to keep with a true 'Cleveland' and the pricing is better than a Dart or Fontana aluminum block. I might not build it straight away, but I'm damn sure I'm gonna get one while they are going who knows when this opportunity will come around again. Heck, if I could afford it I'd get two.
This has gotta be a great option for Pantera owner's to keep with a true 'Cleveland' and the pricing is better than a Dart or Fontana aluminum block. I might not build it straight away, but I'm damn sure I'm gonna get one while they are going who knows when this opportunity will come around again. Heck, if I could afford it I'd get two.
It's apparent that he isn't making any until he fulfills his minimum, in advance. He hasen't stated what that number is.
It sure looks pretty. Aluminum blocks even look pretty broken. Too bad there isn't going to be any durabilaty proving before you put it in your car.
It sure looks pretty. Aluminum blocks even look pretty broken. Too bad there isn't going to be any durabilaty proving before you put it in your car.
LOL the thought has crossed my mind ?
Ron
Ron
It's a fantastic deal for $2600. I don't think I can finish everything up in a shop for another $500 though. I think more.
Take Note...
Tod Buttermore has a NEW email address:
tlb351@zoominternet.net
Tod Buttermore has a NEW email address:
tlb351@zoominternet.net
This is the latest from Tod:
Times Up
At this point I have 16 people interested in deposits. That's pretty good, I think, especially considering that they all want aluminum. I will be in touch with everyone regarding contact info.
Tod
Times Up
At this point I have 16 people interested in deposits. That's pretty good, I think, especially considering that they all want aluminum. I will be in touch with everyone regarding contact info.
Tod
Any update ??
Ron
Ron
Hi Ron,
Without contacting Tod directly, I've asked around, and nobody had any information beyond what we've already discussed.
take care, George
Without contacting Tod directly, I've asked around, and nobody had any information beyond what we've already discussed.
take care, George
Tod has a new email address:
tlb427351@yahoo.com
tlb427351@yahoo.com
Thanks G !
Another brief update from Tod:
Quote: "The fixtures are being made. I can't do much until the fixturing is ready. In the mean time I am working on several other projects. A couple of deposits have been sent in. I am working on setting up my company and getting space to run this thing out of. Harmony Castings is very busy. I fall asleep alot."
Quote: "The fixtures are being made. I can't do much until the fixturing is ready. In the mean time I am working on several other projects. A couple of deposits have been sent in. I am working on setting up my company and getting space to run this thing out of. Harmony Castings is very busy. I fall asleep alot."
Is there an expected delivery date for the first blocks? Aside from the initial orders, I think there are many of us "sitting on the fence" waiting to see how these turn out. If all goes well I might just sell my left nut for one of these blocks.
quote:Originally posted by ParaPantera:
I might just sell my left nut for one of these blocks.
You won't get much for it. There are a lot of them on Ebay this time of the year.
Forget about gold, diamonds and platinum Santa, I want aluminum.