Pirelli is currently celebrating its heritage, what this means for us is that they are more willing to re-issue P7 tires.

Re-issues of classic tires are "reproductions" in appearance and size, but they are constructed using modern rubber compounds and modern construction techniques. They "look" like the classic tire they are emulating in sidewall design and tread pattern, but they are thoroughly modern in terms of performance. A specific size of tire can only be re-issued if the tire model had been previously manufactured in that size.



Wide Body Pantera Owners:

Dougal Cawley of Longstone Classic Tyres says the 345/35ZR15 P7 shall be available any day now and the 285/40ZR15 P7 shall be available soon.

MONEY TALKS, to keep these classic tires available PLEASE support the efforts of Longstone Classic Tyres by giving them your business.



Narrow Body Pantera Owners can be divided into two groups ...

Group 1, those with an interest in 50 series Pirelli P7s:

Pirelli already makes a P7 re-issue of the 225/50VR15. But the 285/50VR15 hasn’t been “stocked” for a long time. Interpreting comments made by Dougal, it seems the 285mm tires, both 285/50 and 285/40, are considered odd-ball sizes. Dougal says he will “consider” asking Pirelli to re-issue the 285/50VR15 P7, especially if the 285/40ZR15 P7 sells well (the front tire for the wide body Panteras).

If you would like to see the 285/50VR15 re-issued please email Dougal and express your interest, give him an idea of the demand for tires in this size. His email address is: dougal@longstonetyres.co.uk

Group 2, those who prefer a larger diameter tire set, more akin to the Goodyear Arrivas:

All "Pre-1979" Panteras were equipped with either 70 series radials, or 60 series Arriva bias ply tires, about 6,600 Panteras. The Pirelli P7 tires were not OEM tires for the majority of Panteras, and they were never available in 60 or 70 series sizes; but that doesn't mean there isn't a worthy set of tires amongst the range of P7 tires that were manufactured. It has been my observation that most owners prefer a wider/lower profile tire than what their car was originally equipped with. So I have a "third set of tires" to suggest, available as Pirelli P7s, to meet the needs of the owners of Pre-1979 Panteras.

I have suggested to Dougal that Pirelli P7s re-issued in the sizes of 225/55VR15 and 275/55VR15 would be the ideal tire set for the majority of the 6,600 Pre-1979 Panteras (excepting for those Panteras whose owners prefer the smaller diameter 50 series P7s). I can't think of a more ideal set of tires for the narrow body Panteras, they have the "square shoulder", wide tread, low profile looks everyone prefers, they are 20mm wider than the Arrivas but not too wide. They are the proper width for the OEM wheels; the 275mm rear tire will fit either the 15x8 OR 15x10 rear wheels. They are the same diameters as the Arrivas, they are speed rated, they have the “period correct” look of the P7 sidewall and tread pattern, and they are thoroughly modern in terms of handling and performance.

If you would be interested in Pirelli P7s re-issued in these sizes for your Pantera please email Dougal and express your interest in this tire set.

-G
Original Post
Send Dougal some Paypal deposits, show you are serious and that this isn't just another one of those everyone expresses an interest, but no one actually buys them when done deals. Smiler
I did email Dougal registering interest in Georges 'Group 2' 225/55/15-275/55/15 selection.
He replied:
"Hi, Sorry they are not making that combination. Have you read this thread on the De Thomaso (sic) forum (link to the recent thread)
I sort of guess this is where you're coming from.
Currently we can't get that set up perfectly."
Goes on to say he is going to study the thread more thoroughly, he's been at Goodwood last five days (lucky) and will give a better answer tomorrow. Regards, etc...

I'll let you all know what he says.
All of the sizes Pirelli has reproduced are ex-OEM. As examples, the 225/50-15 and 345/35-15 are Lamborghini Countach sizes. Even the "oddball" 285/40-15 (w/ 225/50-15 front) is an OEM Porsche 911 size (RS, RSR, GP2, etc). Wide body Pantera owners just got lucky. I'm sure the push to produce these sizes came from Lamborghini and Porsche, who Pirelli has an ongoing relationship with. These applications also fit well with the marketing of Pirelli's vintage offerings. Don't underestimate how important that is. Longstone Tyre will be lucky to get a single P7 size reproduced for us and it will make their job much easier if it's an OEM size. We had all better get on the same page if we want this to get done. I'm not disputing the 275/55-15 is a better size for the rear of most regular body Panteras but I don't believe Pirelli will make the financial commitment to produce a non-OEM size and they certainly won't make two! I believe the only size we stand a chance of getting is the size of P7 that DeTomaso fitted to 10" rear wheels; the 285/50-15.
George,

What I meant by OEM was DeTomaso OEM. Pirelli isn't re-making these P7 sizes for profit. It isn't necessarily about selling tires or determining the best fitment. It appears to be a marketing/advertising exercise more than anything. It's all about Pirelli's history and nostalgia. I'd even speculate that Pirelli already has a regular body Pantera sized tire (or tires) in the works. This paragraph is taken directly from Pirelli's European web site:

"Although it was officially launched onto the market in January 1976 in the road version, the Pirelli P7 had been experimented in the World Rally Championship races since 1974 with the Lancia Stratos. Named Supersport, the new radial brought important innovations into the world of racing tyres, such as the nylon zero degree belt and in particular an ultra- low profile geometry Serie 50. Thus, the development process of the low profile tyres that Pirelli had started with the Cinturati CN73, CN54 and CN36 (Serie 70) and with the Cinturato CN12 (Serie 60) between late ‘60s and early ‘70s, kept going on with the P7. In the same way that the road version led to making the Serie 50 available to standard- model cars, the P7 used in racing quickly introduced ultra-low profile sizes, all the way to the Serie 30. The road P7 was adopted for the first time on the Porsche 911 Carrera Turbo, followed by the Lamborghini Urraco and Countach in 1976, as well as by the De Tomaso Pantera. In the size 195/50 VR 15, the Pirelli P7 was also homologated for the road version of the Fiat 131 Rally.".

Perhaps we're more important to Pirelli than we think we are!
quote:

Originally posted by David_Nunn:

... I'd even speculate that Pirelli already has a regular body Pantera sized tire (or tires) in the works ...



Speculation gets us nowhere. I speculate they haven't. One mention in a history blurb means nothing, and promises less. I don't think Pirelli gives a damn about De Tomaso owners. Hasn't Dougal mentioned several times it would help get the 285/50VR15 reissued IF it had a fitment other than just the Pantera? It doesn't seem Pantera fitment has much weight in Dougal's mind.

Reissues of the 285/40VR15 and 345/35VR15 tire set, and reissues of the 225/50VR15 and 285/50VR15 tire set, are cool, I'd seriously like to see them in stock again. BUT those reissues only help (at most) 20% of the Pantera owners. What about everyone else? Do they keep using BF Goodrich?

If they were planning to issue a tire set for everyone else, then of course Pirelli shall issue it in an OEM sized set. Pirelli will not reissue tires in the size of the Goodyear Arrivas! That leaves the 185/70VR15 and 215/70VR15 tire set for the Pantera. Wouldn't a reissue in those sizes be a let down? I haven't seen or heard of anyone from Pirelli asking for our input. Do you want people to sit back and do nothing, just take whatever bones Pirelli throws us?

I've given Dougal his ammunition, the 225/55VR15 and 275/55VR15 tire sets were OEM on Bimmers and Bentleys. If Longstone Classic Tyres were to have P7s re-issued for the Bimmer and Bentley in the name of nostalgia who cares? Aren't the wide body tires actually reissued for Porsches and Lamborghinis? Once the 225/55VR15 and 275/55VR15 are in stock there shall be nothing keeping De Tomaso owners from purchasing them too.

The iron is hot, its time to strike. I hope your comments don't discourage anybody. I hope people will still email Dougal. If we want to be heard, we'll have to offer our input without waiting to be asked. We need to stir the pot and see what rises to the top. We can influence our own destinies, and squeaky wheels get greased. Sitting on our arses and doing nothing gets us nowhere.

That was and still is the purpose of this announcement.
George,

I'm not trying to discourage anyone from letting Longstone Tyre know what they want. Quite the opposite. How about polling the entire membership of P.I., to see how many people would buy new 15" P7's and if they would, what sizes? Then Dougal can approach Pirelli with some solid statistics.
The 225/55 & 275/55 tire set was only 1/3 of my announcement. I asked those interested in the 285/50VR15 reissue to write in favor of that too. And I announced the impending availability of the wide body tire set. However, you seem focused on the 225/55 & 275/55 tire set.

I see no reason for the poll you suggested.

(1) No one has mentioned an alternative (amongst tires that can be reissued) to the 225/55VR15 and 275/55VR15 tire set, for the OEM wheels. There aren't multiple choices requiring a decision.
(2) Emails to Dougal are a type of statistic.
(3) Dougal hasn't asked for statistics.
(4) This is not an effort pushing for an all new tire set for the Pantera. Its simply a request for reissues, taking advantage of the fact that Pirelli are in the mood for reissues.
Hi George -

I plan to make a request, but was uncertain which sizes are appropriate / recommended for a pair of 8" Fronts, and 10" Rears on a narrowbody car.

Thanks for stirring up interest.

Rocky

[EDIT] I just saw Reaper's note... Our posts crossed in the mail.... sort of.
Perhaps it would be helpful if I threw my own personal experience out there. I purchased a batch of 30 pairs of Yokohama 285/40/VR15 when the opportunity arose about 4 years ago - at the time fronts for my GT5S were next to impossible to find and I figured they would be easy enough to resell. So, on the back of a few "I'd buy them's" I funded the venture myself - it took me 2 years to sell them and 90% went to Renault 5 Turbo owners.... In the end I profited to the tune of one free set for me. Would I bother again? I think not, and can totally see why there is significant reluctance to do this for pantera owners as a commercial venture.

Andy
I asked Longstone if Pirelli were going to manufacture tyres for my Pantera.

They replied that they HOPED the Pirelli range would continue to expand!

This sort of reply is as much use as a chocolate fireguard, My 2 new NANKING 295/50/R15s fit and were cheap but the weights to get them balanced was horrendous.
Yeah if you read the reviews Naking haven't figured out how to make tires round yet. You get what you pay for!

This is a great thread or should I say 'tread', everyone wants a different tires size! And speaking of get what you pay for, that's before any mention of pricing. Just wait until it is announced these are $400+ a pop, then see the cats scatter quicker than throwing a Coyote in a Cattery
quote:
Originally posted by Joules:
Yeah if you read the reviews Naking haven't figured out how to make tires round yet. You get what you pay for!

This is a great thread or should I say 'tread', everyone wants a different tires size! And speaking of get what you pay for, that's before any mention of pricing. Just wait until it is announced these are $400+ a pop, then see the cats scatter quicker than throwing a Coyote in a Cattery


Your right of course Joules, the Nankangs were£67 each, other tyres of a better quality were from £450 to over£650 each.

I dont race and get my state pension, Not only do I get what I pay for, I also get what I can afford.

My wheels are Roin 10" alloy copies and are very nice too.
quote:
Pantera Miami


Hi Sharkey

These tyres won't be available through Tire Rack. they are specialist tyres. In the US They are available through Lucas Antique tyres. try this links.

https://www.lucasclassictires....RATO-P7-2854015p.htm

The 345/35 is so new they don't have a link up yet, but it shouldn't be long.

Any way the best thiing to do is give those chaps a ring and see what you can arrange with them. they have a container en route. -- 1(800)952-4333

Dougal
quote:
Originally posted by George P:
Dougal! Is the 285/50VR15 P7 going to happen? I started this thread in March, here it is September! Are you really in talks with the snobs at Pirelli? Or have you been pulling our chains? I feel there's smoke billowing up my lower bung.


I like a bit of straight talking, so i appreciate Georges Silver tongue way of gong about it.

It has taken me some time to get the 285/40ZR15 P7 made. https://www.longstonetyres.co....li-cinturato-p7.html I would have thought you guys were kind of pleased that Pirelli had made that commitment and reproduced such an obscure obsolete size that never did sell large volumes. who else makes a tyre that size for such small batches. I would have thought thanking Pirelli would have been more in line than calling them snobs. they did it. no one else gave a hoot.

I cannot guarantee this will happen. If it does, it will take some time. I suppose the other reference you could consider was i arranged a similar thing for the Countach community. i think if you want to know more of how it worked for those guys this could be an interesting read for you https://www.ferrarichat.com/fo...-anyone-care.508651/

Assume it is going to take a few years. (if it is less it will come as a pleasant surprise)

and please be nice about Pirelli. they have been better to the Pantera community than any other tyre manufacturer!
Dougal,

It just seems odd that Pirelli made the decision to re-introduce a tire (285/40-15 P7) that has a market of a few hundred cars, yet they have not decided to re-introduce the 285/50-15 P7, which has a potential market of more than a thousand cars. It's as if selling tires isn't Pirelli's primary motivation when it comes to re-introducing these "old" tires to the market.
Silver tongue? Me?

My Pantera does not use the wide tires. I agree with you, the guys with the wide body Panteras should be thanking you. Finding tires for their wide 15 inch wheels has been such a problem for them in the past. They've been strangely silent. I'm sorry for that. Its not too hard to write thank you on a computer.
quote:
Originally posted by www.longstone.com:
... and please be nice about Pirelli. they have been better to the Pantera community than any other tyre manufacturer!

Need I remind you that Michelin offers the XWX in 185/70R15 and 215/70R15. Or that BF Goodrich offers the TA Radial in 205/60R15 and 255/60R15.

If Pirelli made a CN12 in 205/60WR15 then I could combine it with the existing Miura tire (CN12 in 255/60WR15) and that would be a groovy set of tires for my Pantera. Like many other Pantera owners, I could also buy a set of reproduction 10x15 wheels, install the 225/50R15 P7 up front, and combine it with the 285/50R15 at the other end ... if it were available. But as things stand today you don't offer a set of tires for the vast majority of Panteras, including mine.

Since there's no update regarding the 285/50R15 tire size, I assume there hasn't been any mention to Pirelli yet. No "talks" regarding that particular size have been initiated. Is that a valid assumption? By the way I heard you, once talks are under way it shall take years.

I noticed in the thread you linked, that Longstone Tyre is marked as a supporter of FerrariChat, we could use some support too. How would you like a Longstone banner next to Mr. Fiat and SACC Restorations? It might bring you a few extra sales ... some of these guys have several collector cars in their garages.

The 225/50R15 and 345/35R15 are made because of the Countach. The 285/40R15 is made because of Porsche. Correct? Pirelli are snobs from my perspective so long as the needs of the De Tomaso owner aren't part of their decision making process. That will change the day you can announce that 285/50R15 P7s are on the shelf (or 205/60WR15 CN12s). I'm sure they can take a little tease from an old Okie until then. I hope the same goes for you. If you're ever out this way, come on by and share a bottle of 18 year Macallans or Four Roses bourbon. Debbie and I will put you up downtown in the Bella Maggiore.

P.S. My wife's SUV is shod with Pirelli Scorpions, the next set of tires going on my Pantera shall be Pirelli as well.
George,

Rather than snobbery, it's probably the almighty buck that's driving Pirelli. They do Countach owners a favor in order to gain brownie points with the powers-that-be within Lamborghini. After all, it's significant if Lamborghini decides to put Pirelli tires on new Lambo's. Same goes for Porsche. Unfortunately, we no longer have a manufacturer for Pirelli to suck-up to!
Lets try and deal with these all in one. Although it is quite upsetting how cynical you are. can you not see that you are having one of the worlds best tyre manufacturers make such an obscure small volume tyre for you.

David_Nunn
"It just seems odd that Pirelli made the decision to re-introduce a tire (285/40-15 P7) that has a market of a few hundred cars, yet they have not decided to re-introduce the 285/50-15 P7, which has a potential market of more than a thousand cars."

This is based on the fact, that because there is no alternative for a 285/40R15 road tyre at all. At Longstone Tyres we received requests for 285/40R15 tyres from DeThomaso owners. It became apparent that there was a small demand for this tyre and there was no option. Also the fact that there are some Porsche owners and a few Lamborghini owners that would help get this tyre size near to being a viable size to make. It is because we encouraged them to make them and told them we would be able to sell them and make them viable. They are made because of the investment from both; us at Longstone stocking and marketing these tyres and from Pirelli finding the time within their production schedule and investing in a mold.

Correct me if i am wrong, but there were 362 cars - GT4, GT5 & GT5-S cars made, that could want this 285/40R15 tyre as a front.

There were only about 100 GTS and Group 3 cars made, which, i'm sure you can see made it appear that the demand for a 285/50R15 was very minimal, also backed up by there being a 275/55R15 CR6ZZ tyre that works as a good alternative.

It is only because of my presence on this forum talking to you guys that have made it apparent that so many of the earlier cars have now fitted these wheels that make it so that a 285/50R15 Cinturato P7 tyre is the one you want. Which correct me if i am wrong is the case? It is not due to the original production of this tyre, but only because of events post production that means that the earlier pre 79 cars now have the bigger wheel and want the 285/50R15 tyres on the rear. surely you can see that to the outsider it would appear that hardly any cars fitted a 285/50? Pirelli can't guess these things. They use me to find out.

"It's as if selling tires isn't Pirelli's primary motivation when it comes to re-introducing these "old" tires to the market."

Please don't be so cynical, Please don't abuse Pirelli if you want them to make the tyre that you want. this is the sort of comment that would give Pirelli the opinion that if they make the effort to make this tyre for you again, you are not going to buy it.

George P

"My Pantera does not use the wide tires. I agree with you, the guys with the wide body Panteras should be thanking you. Finding tires for their wide 15 inch wheels has been such a problem for them in the past. They've been strangely silent. I'm sorry for that. Its not too hard to write thank you on a computer."

Ha Ha! we don't need thank yous's. we just need to sell the tyres. I have loads in stock, and when Pirelli make some other batches only then will it start to make the investment in the mold plausible.

"Need I remind you that Michelin offers the XWX in 185/70R15 and 215/70R15. Or that BF Goodrich offers the TA Radial in 205/60R15 and 255/60R15."

Michelin XWX are great, I'm not a massive fan of the COMP TA, but that is a difficult tyre combination. Making a 205/60R15 is tricky to justify, because i don't know anything else that would fit it. Also correct me if i am wrong, but if Pirelli made a 205/60, that would take away directly from the potential sales of a 285/50R15 P7? I'm not saying that a 205/60R15 will not happen. But lets take things one step at a time. It has to be commercially viable.

"Since there's no update regarding the 285/50R15 tire size, I assume there hasn't been any mention to Pirelli yet. No "talks" regarding that particular size have been initiated. Is that a valid assumption? By the way I heard you, once talks are under way it shall take years."

I am in talks with them about this size, but it is not as yet set in production. It will take time. Please be patient.

"I noticed in the thread you linked, that Longstone Tyre is marked as a supporter of FerrariChat, we could use some support too. How would you like a Longstone banner next to Mr. Fiat and SACC Restorations? It might bring you a few extra sales ... some of these guys have several collector cars in their garages."

FerrariChat covers a wide range of car makes and there are loads of Ferrari, and FerrariChat gets loads of traffic. There are very few DeThomaso cars. email me and talk to me about cost.

But please bare in mind that the investment that has been made in DeThomaso from our side, by far out ways the profits. We are a profit making entity as is Pirelli of course, but that doesn't mean we sitting in the Ritz sipping Champagne based on the massive profits made out of the DeThomaso community. We want to do the job right supply you guys with the best possible tyres for a fair price. If you don't believe that try to buy alternative Countach tyres and you will see how fair we are. read the comments from customers, and i think on balance you will find they feel we have been fair, but that it took a long time; which it just does. The same would apply to the 285/40R15 P7. That is a good fair price. Our hope is, that way we maintain a good reputation, that reflects well on Both Longstone Tyres and Pirelli, but of course we must also make a profit.

"The 225/50R15 and 345/35R15 are made because of the Countach."

No, the 225/50R15 P7 was made for Porsche. I helped justify the production of the 345/35R15 P7, because it would increase the sales of the 225/50R15.

"The 285/40R15 is made because of Porsche. Correct?"

Not completely correct. It raised it's head because of interest from DeThomaso, which would help increase the sales volume of the 345/35R15 P7. Also because of interest from Porsche who were also reasonably well satisfied by Michelin TB tyres. But it is not correct to believe that it is just for Porsche. It started because of the Pantera. If you notice, the tyres that were made for Porsche have Porsche N4 homologation. However all things considered, if it had really been made for Porsche - would it matter? i don't think so.

"Pirelli are snobs from my perspective so long as the needs of the De Tomaso owner aren't part of their decision making process."

that is not fair and unfounded, because DeThomaso were part of the decision. and be realistic, why should they make an obsolete tyre for an obsolete car brand? they are of course a commercial entity. this is not a charity. However between us, we got that front tyre made, and the plan is to make your 285/50. Please do not be rude about Pirelli. Financially we want this range to wash it's own face. It will never make what a massive organisation like Pirelli would consider a profit worth considering. there just aren't enough cars. They like making tyres in batches of 1,000,000+. If this range can wash it's face and promotes the Pirelli brand they will do it. but if they make a batch of tyres, nobody buys them and they go round bad mouthing them. why would they give a S**t about anything we ask them to make. Currently Pirelli's dedication to making tyres for the likes of the Countach, Porsche, Audi Quattro etc and the Pantera is fantastic. they deserve our thanks not our abuse.

So what if they are doing it because they think it is a good marketing exercise. I agree doing a good job of helping weird cars be able to get the right tyre is a great way of doing it, and you only benefit from it

" I'm sure they can take a little tease from an old Okie until then. I hope the same goes for you. If you're ever out this way, come on by and share a bottle of 18 year Macallans or Four Roses bourbon. Debbie and I will put you up downtown in the Bella Maggiore."

That sounds like a great idea. I'd love to come and guzzle "The Macallan" till my eyes go red some time with you and Debbie. i do keep fantasizing about popping out to the States again, and maybe racing at Laguna Seca during pebble Beach in my silly little racing car https://www.youtube.com/watch?...rKx1W4HE7_ZSWsg0qkkh
I am very happy that we can get any tyres for our cars at all, that said I would love to have a matched set of either Pirellis or of Avons on my Pantera.
It is running 225/50/15 on the front and 295/50/15 (Avon CR6ZZ) on the back. The CR6ZZ even has a tread pattern more correct if we compare with the Goodyear Arriva. However, I have just lashed out and purchased a set of the Pirelli P7s in the 225/50/15 (from Longstone) to replace the 9 year old japanese brand that is on the front, and I am itching for them to be released from the courier locally, so I can have them fitted.
So from me to Longstone and other people behind the scenes, thanks that we do have quality road tyres in the right sizes for the majority of Panteras.
Dougal,

The 225/50-15 - 285/50-15 P7 combination may have only been OEM on European GTS Panteras manufactured after the P7 became available but that size combination fits the thousands of regular L and pre-L Panteras made between '71 and '74. Some will say a 285/50-15 is a bit wide for the Pantera's 8" OEM wheel but it was within Pirelli's range of approved wheel widths. Furthermore, hundreds of owners have fitted the OEM 10" rear wheels which are perfect for the 285/50-15. None of this will be news to Pirelli, assuming they still have records of how many 285/50-15 P7's they sold while it was in production. They certainly would have sold more than 100 pairs of tires! Keep in mind, there were VR speed rated alternatives back then, including the 275/55-15 P7. Today, in a matched set, there are none.
quote:

Originally posted by www.longstone.com:

... If this range can wash it's face and promotes the Pirelli brand they will do it ...


I have confidence that if this 285/50R15 tire (tyre) is stocked it shall sell very well.

quote:

Originally posted by René #4406:

It's obvious that the 285/40/15 are very difficult to use in the back of Pantera, they are 11.4% too small.


René that is the front tire for the wide body Panteras (GT4, GT5, GT5-S). It is about the same diameter as the 225/50R15 which is the front tire for narrow body Panteras equipped with P7s. They are both about 24 inches (61cm) diameter.

There are four OEM tire sets installed on Panteras manufactured from 1971 to 1990:

Set 1 1971-1972 185/70VR15 + 215/70VR15 This set is available in Michelin XWX. There is little demand for this size.
Set 2 1973-1977 205/60VR15 + 255/60VR15 This set is available in BFG Radial T/A (speed rated S). The Rear is also available in Pirelli CN12.
Set 3 1978-1984 225/50VR15 + 285/50VR15 The Front is available in Pirelli P7 and P-Zero. THE REAR IS NOT AVAILABLE ANYWHERE.
Set 4 1978-1990 285/40VR15 + 345/35VR15 This set is available in Pirelli P7.

The rear tire for set 3 is the tire currently under discussion, and the most urgent need.

A great number of owners of 1971-1977 Panteras retro-fitted their Panteras with factory 10x15 rear wheels, and moved the 8x15 rear wheels to the front position, in order to accommodate the tires of set 3. Every 10x15 wheel that De Tomaso had stocked, at least a cargo container full of them, sold-out long ago. The 10x15 wheel remains popular even though the proper tire hasn't been available for years. When a used set of 10x15 wheels comes-up for sale, they sell quickly at top dollar prices. There are not one but two aftermarket companies manufacturing this wheel still today (Roin and Marvic). I know people who have purchased used Panteras simply because they had this size rear wheel. They removed the 10x15 wheels, replaced them with 8x15 wheels, and placed the Pantera up for sale again.
.
quote:
Originally posted by George P:

René that is the front tire for the wide body Panteras (GT4, GT5, GT5-S). It is about the same diameter as the 225/50R15 which is the front tire for narrow body Panteras equipped with P7s. They are both about 24 inches (61cm) diameter.

There are four OEM tire sets installed on Panteras manufactured from 1971 to 1990:

Set 1 1971-1972 185/70VR15 + 215/70VR15 This set is available in Michelin XWX. There is little demand for this size.
Set 2 1973-1977 205/60VR15 + 255/60VR15 This set is available in BFG Radial T/A (speed rated S). The Rear is also available in Pirelli CN12.
Set 3 1978-1984 225/50VR15 + 285/50VR15 The Front is available in Pirelli P7 and P-Zero. THE REAR IS NOT AVAILABLE ANYWHERE.
Set 4 1978-1990 285/40VR15 + 345/35VR15 This set is available in Pirelli P7.

The rear tire for set 3 is the tire currently under discussion, and the most urgent need.

A great number of owners of 1971-1977 Panteras retro-fitted their Panteras with factory 10x15 rear wheels, and moved the 8x15 rear wheels to the front position, in order to accommodate the tires of set 3. Every 10x15 wheel that De Tomaso had stocked, at least a cargo container full of them, sold-out long ago. The 10x15 wheel remains popular even though the proper tire hasn't been available for years. When a used set of 10x15 wheels comes-up for sale, they sell quickly at top dollar prices. There are not one but two aftermarket companies manufacturing this wheel still today (Roin and Marvic). I know people who have purchased used Panteras simply because they had this size rear wheel. They removed the 10x15 wheels, replaced them with 8x15 wheels, and placed the Pantera up for sale again.
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That's exactly what I would like to do if Pirelli were making 285/50VR15 and you're obviously right when you say there's a lot more Pantera L in circulation than GT4, GT5 or GT5S.
While waiting for Pirelli to may be produce 285/50 VR15 for the rear of the Pantera L and GTS, there are the AVON CR6ZZ in 295/50 VR15 which have almost the same diameter as the 265/60/15 (26.61"vs 27.05").
Unfortunately AVON does not manufacture CR6ZZ in 225/50 VR15.
CR6ZZ being road-approved race tires, it seems to me that it is not recommended to use them with front tires such as Pirelli P7 or P Zero which are excellent but "normal" road tires.

But there are the Toyo R888R which are also road-approved race tires that exist in 225/50 ZR15, do you think they are compatible with the AVON CR6ZZ?
Rene, I'm not a tire expert, only a (frequent) consumer, so take the following with a grain of salt. For several years in the late '80s we competed in autocross (1st & 2nd gear only) in a home-built Gr-3-type '72 pre-L with a high-power engine for the time and a pair of 245-50x 15 Yokohama radials on 8" front wheels with Hoosier 295-50 x 15 belted-bias tires on 10" wheels in back. We literally did not care if the treads matched all around- this was about competing at speed, not a car show.

The car handled well enough with "mismatched tires" to win a State Championship in B/Prepared Stock one year & as runner-up to a Corvette with much larger tires the next year. So I suspect the prohibition of mismatching tires is for those ON THE SAME AXLE, not necessarily the same on both ends of the car. In other words, one should not run a Yokohama on the left front and a Goodyear on the right front. Squirrely handling might then show up, especially at higher speeds than those we enjoyed with this Pantera.

Note also the soft, road-legal Hoosier DOTs in the rear were both worn to the cords in less than 1000 miles of autocrossing plus legal street driving to and from the 12 events that year... Your mileage may vary!
A real racing driver, which I'm not, is able to cope with an unbalanced car, but I'm afraid that tires with a big difference in grip between the front and the rear create problems especially when braking especially on a Pantera that already has this problem at the origin, hence my question.
You could cope - especially if the front tires break loose well before the rears. You would just understeer and slide - scrubbing speed until you slow down enough to be able to turn (hopefully you don't hit anything before then). This is how almost all new cars are set up to handle.

The mismatched front/back thing is not much different than having the suspension (mis)adjusted in a way that sets up the same characteristics.

If you never drive your car in a way that makes any of the tires lose lateral grip, then you'd never notice the difference (except for maybe tire noise, ride comfort, or looks).

Hi

 I'm sorry if I am spamming this comment a little but I would like to try to rally up as much support as possible so I don't want anyone that might be interested to miss it. I hope you'll agree it is for a good cause. I have the blessings of the forum administrator.

I have made a De Tomaso Pantera  web page, here's a link: 
 Longstone Tyres - De Tomaso Pantera page
Please let me know if you see any mistakes. Any pictures you have that might make it better please send them over.

 Importantly if you may be interested in a set of the 285/50R15 P7 tyres please drop me a note via the "contact us" link so we can keep your email on file and use that collection of email addresses to convince Pirelli to make these tyres.

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